18 replies to this topic

[KERABO]

I am a new member on here. I am also a member of the Francis Barnett Owners Club and through this have now taken ownership of a converted FB trials. Its based on a 1959 FB Falcon.
What i need help with is to identify the conversion on the engine. The bottom end is a Villiers 9E but the top end I was told is a 250 conversion. I have attempted to recearch this and the nearest I can find is a Marcell conversion. Can anyone confirm this or knows more about this. Its all alloy and the inlet stub is deep into the fins with 3 screws holding it on .The exhaust is held by 2 screws The only marking is at the base of the barrel and I think it MB
My second attempt to do this as the first sems to have gone missing although it want to stop me using web site details

With luck my pictures will be visible to you .
Regards Ken


http://s263.photobucket.com/albums/ii151/K...eneral%20stuff/

Edited by KERABO, 16 July 2010 - 11:41 AM.

[TRICKYMICKY]

The bike sold on e bay a year or so ago. Then i saw it at an autojumble about 6 weeks ago. It could be a Parkinson barrel-looks very similar to the one on my Butler trials bike

Edited by TRICKYMICKY, 16 July 2010 - 04:10 PM.

[Old trials fanatic]

Are you sure the bottom end is 9E ? as i have three of those engines in the shed and they all have the barrel at a slight forward angle not upright as yours is. Might be wrong but it just caught my eye.

[ask greeves]

Hello, I would agree with Trickymicky, looks like Parkinson Conversion. Don't know about the 'upright 9e' Engine, could it be a Chinese copy ! What interests me is the middle silencer, looks very much like a 1968 Vauxhall Victor middle exhaust box.

Edited by ask greeves, 16 July 2010 - 08:06 PM.

[turps]

I'm pretty sure that Francis Barnett and James both used 8e engines rather than 9e and this would explain the vertical barrel. I hope this helps.

[KERABO]

Old trials fanatic, on Jul 16 2010, 08:50 PM, said:

Are you sure the bottom end is 9E ? as i have three of those engines in the shed and they all have the barrel at a slight forward angle not upright as yours is. Might be wrong but it just caught my eye.

Yes the number equates to a reat breed of 3 wheeler and says 9E

Thanks Ken

[KERABO]

ask greeves, on Jul 16 2010, 09:05 PM, said:

Hello, I would agree with Trickymicky, looks like Parkinson Conversion. Don't know about the 'upright 9e' Engine, could it be a Chinese copy ! What interests me is the middle silencer, looks very much like a 1968 Vauxhall Victor middle exhaust box.

Yes the silencer does look car like but with help from you guys I hope to improve on that.

Regards Ken

[KERABO]

turps, on Jul 16 2010, 09:05 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure that Francis Barnett and James both used 8e engines rather than 9e and this would explain the vertical barrel. I hope this helps.

Engine number is 049D 13749 Does this help identify it

Regards Ken

[hewson]

Looks like a marcelle from the bottom identification ........

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[KERABO]

After a little searching I found a site that gave the following as a reply to my engine number. Is this good Or have I purchased a DUD

Regards Ken



JW Villiers Engines
Query on 149D returned 1Engine Model 32A 246cc Made( 60-66) BorexStroke( 66 X 72) Rotor(R134) Armature(A139) Carb( S25)
Customer [models if known] Cotton:: Cotton Trail
No specific information about carb and magneto, Villiers standard has been assumed
Four speed W First 3.60 Second 2.18 Third 1.56 Top 1.00
Villiers Singles Database based on data from Villiers factory data sheets,the VMCC machine book, Glass's Guide, and emails from Villiers owners
Where multiple records exist - Some models are known to have been supplied to several customers. Conflicting data - Yes, It does happen

[ask greeves]

Interesting information from Hewson, i think you might have to consider that the cylinder head and barrell could be from different manufacturers. Will be interesting to know your final conclusions, to what exactly you've got.

[MartinM]

KERABO, on Jul 17 2010, 09:47 AM, said:

After a little searching I found a site that gave the following as a reply to my engine number. Is this good Or have I purchased a DUD

Regards Ken



JW Villiers Engines
Query on 149D returned 1Engine Model 32A 246cc Made( 60-66) BorexStroke( 66 X 72) Rotor(R134) Armature(A139) Carb( S25)
Customer [models if known] Cotton:: Cotton Trail
No specific information about carb and magneto, Villiers standard has been assumed
Four speed W First 3.60 Second 2.18 Third 1.56 Top 1.00
Villiers Singles Database based on data from Villiers factory data sheets,the VMCC machine book, Glass's Guide, and emails from Villiers owners
Where multiple records exist - Some models are known to have been supplied to several customers. Conflicting data - Yes, It does happen

Hi Ken

Think you searched on the right site for info.....you entered the wrong engine number (149D not 049D)

I have just searched your info and got 049D back as an 9E

Heres a link Villers ID

Cheers

Martin

Edited by MartinM, 17 July 2010 - 10:07 AM.

[bigplonker]

I reckon it's a Marcelle conversion. But I could be wrong. Has been known. Come to think of it, I'm nearly always wrong about everything, according to 'her indoors'.

[KERABO]

Sorry guys i had made an error with the number its 049D and not 149D This make it a 9E from a dam 3 wheeler. I thought for a moment I was on a winner and had a competion engine.

JW Villiers Engines
Query on 049D returned 1Engine Model 9E 197cc Made( 55-67) BorexStroke( 59 X 72) Rotor(SIBA) Armature(SIBA) Carb(S25/3)
Customer [models if known] H Meadows Vehicles::
No specific information about carb and magneto, Villiers standard has been assumed
Four speed W First 3.25 Second 1.96 Third 1.40 Top 1.00
Villiers Singles Database based on data from Villiers factory data sheets,the VMCC machine book, Glass's Guide, and emails from Villiers owners
Where multiple records exist - Some models are known to have been supplied to several customers. Conflicting data - Yes, It does .

I shall have to wait for someone to see and identify the top end.

Thank you all fopr your help

Ken

[hewson]

I had the same problem when i bought my sprite trials bike , the closest match i found was the Marcelle , but the marcelle as 8 horizontal fin's on the barrel , but mine only as 7 .......

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Edited by hewson, 17 July 2010 - 01:07 PM.