13 replies to this topic

[lakelandramblers]

How the hell do you ride these things!!!!! This morning I set off to the MOT station on my Suzuki SP400 and trials chair, along with two bags of sand as ballast. I now know that you can't brake and turn left at the same time. Anyway now road legal so off this afternoon with my newly press-ganged monkey in the chair and we soon come to terms with left and right turns on tarmac. I presume that the set up is something like as it goes in a straight line, but on right hand turns it under-steers and the front wheel hops sideways. On really tight right turns it feels as if the back end slides sideways under power. When we got the thing off road the fun really started! I don't know how you lot manage to ride these things, going down hill I couldn't stop the thing going to the right, especially when the outfit leant to the right, I presume that I was putting my weight in the wrong place and haven't yet come to terms with the sidecar brake. Climbing back up the track I had even more fun as the front end goes light and steering has little effect on the direction the outfit takes. Other than that riding it is a piece of pi**.
Any help, advice, or tips would be gratefully received, we're off to the Lakes tomorrow for another go.

Edited by lakelandramblers, 24 October 2011 - 08:10 PM.

[B40RT]

They ride you.

[Old trials fanatic]

From what i remember when i had one on the road it was accelerate round left handers and back off the throttle round right handers. Idea being the bike runs around the chair on left handers and the chair tries to overtake the bike on right handers. then again if you get it wrong on a left hander you end up with the combo flipping over but right handers and powersliders are fun. That is assuming the bike is mounted on the right of course. In sections it seems that the monkey holds onto the spokes on tight left handers stopping the chair wheel err thats inteligent not.

To be honest i never understood why anybody would want to go anywhere near one, same with trikes all the bad bits about a car coupled with all the bad bits about a bike with none of the good stuff so why bother?, but i am told they can grow on you. Then again so can verukas

Edited by Old trials fanatic, 24 October 2011 - 10:05 PM.

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guy's.
Hi OTF.
Now I have been called a lot of names in my life, and probably deserved it. But never a Monkey, not even a Grease one. Thanks Mate. IE, probably need an History lesson now dont you????

PS, Is that why my hands are so bad? sticking them into spoked wheels when I was young and stupid!! not much change there then!!,

Regards Charlie.

[Old trials fanatic]

charlie prescott, on 24 October 2011 - 10:43 PM, said:

Hi Guy's.
Hi OTF.
Now I have been called a lot of names in my life, and probably deserved it. But never a Monkey, not even a Grease one. Thanks Mate. IE, probably need an History lesson now dont you????

PS, Is that why my hands are so bad? sticking them into spoked wheels when I was young and stupid!! not much change there then!!,

Regards Charlie.

OOOOPS ! he started it sir. Never knew you rode sidecars Charlie. I only ever had one, that was more than enough, and that was on the road. Two girls were riding one at the last Dales Classic Trial. I still dont get it but good luck to them. Looks all a bit accident looking for somewhere to happen to me. Sidecar trials that is. Two wheels or four wheels me but never three and dont ever mention the Bond Bug incident

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guy's.
Hi OTF.
Bond Bug??? You Never did you???

Regards Charlie.

[Old trials fanatic]

charlie prescott, on 25 October 2011 - 10:57 PM, said:

Hi Guy's.
Hi OTF.
Bond Bug??? You Never did you???

Regards Charlie.

Err yes but not for long. Did a Clarkson me and three wheels dont gel. Well unless it's an old 1275 Mini Cooper S oh fond memories of waving the inside rear wheel in the air on bends. We were all daft when we were young

[lakelandramblers]

We're getting better, spent a day greenlanig in the Lakes today and we are in control 50% of the time now. Bloody hard work though.

[scott_king]

You should try and see a British Championship sidecar event. You see the top riders go over things us mere morals would not attempt on a solo let alone a sidecar.

My brother and father used to sidecar a lot in the early 90s but not any more. My brother was the monkey for Ivan Manning when he won the welsh 2 days many moons ago. I have done a little bit when I was about 12 but that was just playing with my dad. I seem to remember as the monkey that when you going at speed to let your body go limp and not hold onto the chair to hard as its easier on the body. Easier said than done when your barreling along a in the welsh countryside.

Fair play for giving it ago though. Sidecars appear to be a bit of a dying breed but seem to be kept alive by the die hard few.

[charlie prescott]

Hi Guy's.
Hi Scott.
Yes you need your body flexable and limp, But this happens naturaly usally just from the fright.

Welsh Lanes?
Arrr I remember them well! when two top road racers playing at trials sidcars for fun, (Sorry Ron and Dan),
Decide to have a bit of road race practice along these lanes in between sections, all the side kick, (a Monkey would have jumped off) could do is join in or die, Fortunatly Doug and I did survive. But with some narrow scrapes. Oh such Joy.
Wish them days were back again. PS, the Kendalls should have taken up road racing for they were some times Quicker, but boy were words exchanged at the next group of sections.

Regards Charlie.

[lakelandramblers]

Still going at it with the sidecar, getting better each time we go out. We are getting really good at rolling the thing over to the left, sort of tripping over the nose of the sidecar and try to do this at least once on each outing. We've even managed to set fire to it once (Long story, leaking petrol tap, big fire, still ran once we put it out though.) Got tennis elbow from fighting with the steering, bruised knees from bailing out on a rocky Lakedistrict track, still having fun though. We're entered in a long distance classic trial in February (Northern Trial), not sure if we've bitten off more than we can chew, only time will tell.

[Erskine]

Sounds like a nice safe activity.
Mine is nearly all hooked up, just one last strut to make for the rear mounting point.
What have you got your lean out and toe in set at now?

[lakelandramblers]

Erskine, on 24 January 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

Sounds like a nice safe activity.
Mine is nearly all hooked up, just one last strut to make for the rear mounting point.
What have you got your lean out and toe in set at now?

From memory the sidecar wheel lead is about 9.5inches. This was dictated to a great degree by the existing mounting points on the sidecar, particularly the rear mount which doubles up as the left hand foot rest. This did seem to be the general figure quoted on what few sites I could find with information. The lead can be altered by quite an amount by just adjusting the toe-in.
On the subject of toe-in I worked to 1.5inches over the wheelbase of the bike, but again was influenced by the existing rear mount as this had a large steel plate on the end of it, which indicated the toe-in that had been used on the original bike. The outfit MUST have toe-in as this counteracts the drag of the sidecar and any toe-out should result in an MOT fail.
As for the angle of lean I plumbed for the bike being vertical to the sidecar, but the accepted practice for road bikes is a slight lean out. I think this is to counter the camber of the road and keep the bike vertical in use. In practice it doesn't make much difference on unsurfaced roads as the outfit is never vertical for more than a couple of seconds anyway, and the position of the passenger makes a huge difference to the angle of lean. I have fine tuned mine by adjusting the rear shocks on the bike and also the sidecar shock-absorber as ultimately the relevant angle of lean is the one the bike assumes once the pilot and monkey are on board.
Have fun!

[Erskine]

Thanks for that info, it's useful to have a comparison, all be it on a much smaller rig. What did your track/width end up at?
I've finished the rear mount now and have taken the chair off to hook all the electrics/fuel/brakes back up.
Will let you know how I get on. Mine will be used 50% lanes 50% farm tracks/green lane. I have initially set the lean out quite noticeably with the adjustment to bring it back in. There is a marked movement towards vertical when a passenger gets on to the chair, but it will be reduced when I go for the refit.

Edited by Erskine, 26 January 2012 - 12:10 AM.