156 replies to this topic

[beatabeta]

So just been looking on Facebook and Steve Saunders has posted sating the no stop trial he was as yesterday was ridiculous, too hard, impossible to ride as no stop, confusing, off putting for kids who will ultimately be driven away from the sport.

Nearly every response on there was slagging off no stop and wanting 'stop allowed' rules.
Now I don't want to generalise (again) but most of the people of Facebook will be younger than 40 (I appreciate Steve is not below 40) which again tells you who is dictating the rules of our sport - old boys who cannot do or appreciate modern riding.

It was (we are told) the importers who whole heartedly backed this rule change as a 'boost to the sport' well now you 1 importer saying it didn't work.

Now, I can already hear old minds saying 'but its going to take time for the CoC to get these trials right'
Well in my opinion you don't have time now, you've p*ssed about, changed the rules,
Make it right!

Just say at every trial across the country 1 kid or clubman or novice or inter or expert rider gets totally annoyed at the scoring and confusion and fed up at the results. He/she has another trial, same annoyance. How long before he/she calls it a day and packs up trials????? They then tell friends they're not riding anymore, the people who they ride around with may start to discuss if they're enjoying the rules etc and so on and on.
Possibly a bit extreme that every 2 trials ran by every club across the country a rider would quit trials but time is not a luxury that you people who change our sport have...

I still cannot see where/how changing the rules is going to encourage new riders.
Please will someone with superior knowledge to me explain the thought process behind people with less money to spend wanting to spend more and more money on a bike to ride in a sport confused by rules set by its old fashioned dictators!

[bilc0]

So the club f****d up tell them about it, ****.

[Old trials fanatic]

bilc0, on 12 December 2011 - 09:44 AM, said:

So the club f****d up tell them about it, ****.

I wish people who come on here just to have a rant instead did something about it! Like bombard the CoC with complaints about how they spent their Friday and Saturday in the rain laying out a course with no help from the people who just want to turn up on a Sunday and ride. They will appreciate that NOT. In fact they will probably say sod it organise your own trial next time and throw the towel in.

If this change in the rules makes you want to give up the sport why dont you do something possative about it and start your own club and run trials to the rules you want??? Dont say all that crap about i'm busy, got work commitments, got kids, got a mortguage. Dont you think that club organisers all around the country have too !! i know i bloody well have and i also know i will have to make time to lay out our trial this Saturday probably on my own in the wet with no prospect of any thanks for it either. Just like all the other CoC's all over the country this weekend.

When you do it month in month out then you will have earned yourself the right to slag everybody off. How many trials did you lay out this year? How many trials do any of the "Top Lads" for that matter?

I rode in another clubs trial yesterday. I would have laid it out differently considering the conditions because it was obvious from section 1 that the scores were going to be horrendous BUT i am so grateful that somebody spent their time to ensure that i could have a days sport and i am sure they will learn from the day and make sure the next trial is laid out taking the weather more into consideration. I will bear their trial in mind when i lay out this Saturday so it's all a learning curve.

[beatabeta]

Think you've both MASSIVELY missed the point here with your ranting.....
I didn't criticise anyone.
I merely wrote what I'd seen, that no stop didn't work on that trial and said that most comments were 'pro stop allowed'
I also asked for someone clearly more knowledgeable and with superior foresight the question - how no stop will 'boost our sport' as the miracle cure the ACU, importers and some clubs think it will?

Great mentality though guys. You keep it up, moan at anyone below 40 who merely points out whats being discussed and who with an opinion and I'll just quit the sport shall I?

Maybe that's the problem. It's being 'discussed' which is clearly NOT the way to do things at the ACU or club level

[spudsdad]

my understanding of it is that the change to no stop only applys to adult british championship ,all other events are up to centre /club as to what rules they want to run to
so in this case i would not blame the importers

[Pete_Scorpa3]

beatabeta, on 12 December 2011 - 09:21 AM, said:

So just been looking on Facebook and Steve Saunders has posted sating the no stop trial he was as yesterday was ridiculous, too hard, impossible to ride as no stop, confusing, off putting for kids who will ultimately be driven away from the sport.

I think you should read the post again and correct the errors in your statement.

You have accused Steve of saying a lot of things HE DID NOT SAY! Go on, read it again and come back on here and quote him correctly!!!!!!!

As a matter of interest, were you even there?

[Pete_Scorpa3]

Old trials fanatic, on 12 December 2011 - 10:33 AM, said:

I wish people who come on here just to have a rant instead did something about it! Like bombard the CoC with complaints about how they spent their Friday and Saturday in the rain laying out a course with no help from the people who just want to turn up on a Sunday and ride. They will appreciate that NOT. In fact they will probably say sod it organise your own trial next time and throw the towel in.

If this change in the rules makes you want to give up the sport why dont you do something possative about it and start your own club and run trials to the rules you want??? Dont say all that crap about i'm busy, got work commitments, got kids, got a mortguage. Dont you think that club organisers all around the country have too !!

Absolutely spot on OTF!

[minislim]

its just history repeating itself.
back in the late 90's when trials lost its way for a while, they reintroduced no-stop and it rejuvinated trials. yet its been allowed to slip back into a stop permitted way again through the noughties.
dougie was a master at both and adjusted his riding style to go on to win most of his titles.

i remember back then quite a few clubs got their first no-stop trials wrong as some clerks of the course didnt adjusted their routes to suit the new rules.
there is an art to setting a trial out after all.

[GrahamJayzee]

I'm with Pete and OTF here, because I'm forever fearful of the hardened group of volunteer's throwing in the towel and our sport evaporating along with them.

However, I do take a bit of a 'no smoke without fire' stance and think it's worth having a think about the roots of the frustrations. I'm well past 40 myself, but have some sympathy with the Yoof. It does seemlike an age division, whatever the truth is, and we have to be careful we don't create a split that doesn't need to (and in may cases doesn't) exist. I can still remember starting out in trials, and it's so overwhelming that (and I'm not proud of this!), I never gave a second thought to the organisers. I was totally focused on survival and not looking a plum!

I think we're going to see a lot more discussion on this over the next few months, and a lot of emotion. I for one hope that I can avoiding rising when arguments seem badly worded, and try to pull out the germs of interest from each one. In this case, the message I got was that the clubs need to get up to speed pretty quickly. I'm guessing we'll all be able to judge whether the pace of progress is adequate after a few more trials yet!

Graham

[lineaway]

Let`s see you read on facebook that a trial was terribly set,you rant on here about rules,don`t enjoy the feed back, you tell us you are now going to quit because you were raised a spoiled brat. Donate your bike to a kid that wants to ride.

Edited by lineaway, 12 December 2011 - 12:59 PM.

[Suzuki250]

beatabeta, on 12 December 2011 - 11:26 AM, said:

Great mentality though guys. You keep it up, moan at anyone below 40 who merely points out whats being discussed and who with an opinion and I'll just quit the sport shall I?

I much prefer non-stop, plus I’m under 40, and a novice rider.

I totally agree with OTF

[GasGasJamie]

Rode my first no stop trial at club/group level in quite a while yesterday.

Did it work?: Yes, the clerk of the course laid it out open and every section was ride-able without stopping. (Thanks Steve/Jordi)

Was it too hard?: Was a tough trial compared to others in the series, but that was down to the extremely muddy conditions and would of been just as hard stop permitted. The clerk of the course also amended the sections after the first lap which helped.

Was it observed correctly?: Well the tricky conditions made it tricky, and so eleven out of the twelve observers were on the lenient side as far as I could make out (no scores yet). This made the trial better as cleans could be made and there was definitely an effort by all the riders to keep moving.

Was it enjoyable?: Being not a great fan of the piece of land, I wouldn't say it was the best day out ever, but it was definitely a lot better than the same trial in the previous few years.

Overall?: The atmosphere seemed flatter than usual for this series. Perhaps its because its the end of the year and everyone's minds is on Christmas, but I think that the new rules have not won over everyone just yet.

I think its too early to start criticising the rules, we need to give it more time. Would you sack a Premiership manager after just one loss?

Edited by GasGasJamie, 12 December 2011 - 01:10 PM.

[JJ65]

Let's face it, The importers don't sell used bikes do they, their in the buisiness of selling new bikes. The importers know who are buying New Bikes and it ain't the youngsters, it's the middle age male. Yes, he buys his son a new bike occasionally, but most new bikes are sold to middle aged males with the money to buy. That's who their targeting this change, make the sport a bit easier and you'll sell more bikes. Which class of rider has the most in your club? The last trial I did, the O40 clubman etc had the most riders and most of the new bikes were ridden by them.

[B40RT]

beatabeta, on 12 December 2011 - 09:21 AM, said:

So just been looking on Facebook and Steve Saunders has posted sating the no stop trial he was as yesterday was ridiculous, too hard, impossible to ride as no stop, confusing, off putting for kids who will ultimately be driven away from the sport.

Nearly every response on there was slagging off no stop and wanting 'stop allowed' rules.
Now I don't want to generalise (again) but most of the people of Facebook will be younger than 40 (I appreciate Steve is not below 40) which again tells you who is dictating the rules of our sport - old boys who cannot do or appreciate modern riding.

It was (we are told) the importers who whole heartedly backed this rule change as a 'boost to the sport' well now you 1 importer saying it didn't work.

Now, I can already hear old minds saying 'but its going to take time for the CoC to get these trials right'
Well in my opinion you don't have time now, you've p*ssed about, changed the rules,
Make it right!

Just say at every trial across the country 1 kid or clubman or novice or inter or expert rider gets totally annoyed at the scoring and confusion and fed up at the results. He/she has another trial, same annoyance. How long before he/she calls it a day and packs up trials????? They then tell friends they're not riding anymore, the people who they ride around with may start to discuss if they're enjoying the rules etc and so on and on.
Possibly a bit extreme that every 2 trials ran by every club across the country a rider would quit trials but time is not a luxury that you people who change our sport have...

I still cannot see where/how changing the rules is going to encourage new riders.
Please will someone with superior knowledge to me explain the thought process behind people with less money to spend wanting to spend more and more money on a bike to ride in a sport confused by rules set by its old fashioned dictators!

The sport doesn't want to lose anybody, but if we have to choose between riders & COC's ........

[Duggan]

The trials world will never agree on this argument, it's down to personal preference. Maybe different clubs should agree to use different sets of rules so there's a trial out there for everyone to enjoy. In my area we have upto six clubs so this would work fairly well.