47 replies to this topic

[Old trials fanatic]

Greeves, on 30 January 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

Being 10,000 km. away and really not knowing a word about who you are talking with, I consider your first replies quite aggressive and clearly, in my opinion of course, trying to intimidate, ridicule and threaten me to get my silence.

Maybe as you say it is just “aggressive defense” as part of your heart is in Montesa. I can understand that, and not knowing you will give you the benefit of the doubt, and continue a civilized debate without any anger or verbal violence if this is ok for you.

If not, please let me know before we start a ridiculous series of nonsense replies. Will be better for the two of us and much better for those who read this topic.

You came last year to Montesa factory, and say know quite well what is true and what it is not about Montesa. As you do, I also know people inside Montesa.

I believe you know what Montesa means for the great majority of Spaniards, the same as Bultaco, the same as Pegaso… plus some others, If you don´t know it, please let me tell you that you can get really fanaticism attitudes very easily from many Spanish people if you speak about certain topics. Montesa is one of those.

Please have a look to the next pic:

montesa.jpg

Could you please tell me where is Montesa in that pic? Because, in our opinion here in Spain, this photo expresses a clear and stark reality about all those Honda “promises” about Montesa´s future.

Can you please let me know if in your visit to the factory you saw or heard about any Montesa delopment department? Have you heard about any plans for Montesa Enduro bikes? Any plans for Montesa Cross bikes? Any plans for Montesa road or scooter bikes? Where come all those 4RT engines from? Any plans for the real development of Montesa as one of the Spanish Industrial old jewels, not just as a part of Honda´s strategy to get grants and benefits out of our taxes?

Have you seen the “new” 2012 Honda 4RT? It´s really new for you? Where those bikes come from?
What´s the future of Montesa?

Look Mr. Belair, maybe you have the key to clarify this questions. If not, and as you say; “Time will tell and we may revisit this thread in the future to see who was right.” But peacefully if this is possible.

All very well put Javier and all in the very calm and polite manner that i know you for. In all the time i have personally known you you have always been most gracious and a gentleman and the tone and attitude of the earlier posting by Mr Belair was both uncalled for and inexcuseable on an open forum. Perhaps they conduct themselves in a different way in america, sadly sometimes the rest of the world also, but that does not excuse his outburst.

I think it was obvious why Honda bought their way into Europe via Montesa. Just a way of sidestepping import quotas and making the most of grants and tax breaks.

I know how passionate the Spanish are of their history and it will be a shame to see another Classic name dissapear. I just hope the workers find jobs elsewhere for their families sake. It's not easy finding worthwhile employment in a recession hit Europe nowadays which i know from personal experience.

Edited by Old trials fanatic, 30 January 2012 - 02:03 PM.

[Martin Belair]

Greeves, on 30 January 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

Being 10,000 km. away and really not knowing a word about who you are talking with, I consider your first replies quite aggressive and clearly, in my opinion of course, trying to intimidate, ridicule and threaten me to get my silence.

Mr. Greeves, I don't know you and have nothing personal against you. I tired to be considerate in my post, I realized that this would be embarrassing for you, but if you were made to look foolish as I said " I'm sorry but you did it to yourself". All I did was shine a light onto your false statement. You have not admitted your mistake or apologized for spreading false rumors. My conversation with you is finished.

Martin

Edited by Martin Belair, 30 January 2012 - 05:51 PM.

[Greeves]

I haven´t made any mistake in my opinion Mr. Belair, so I agree it´s better to finish it here.

[fatbastard]

I'm with Greeves on this.

[HAM2]

1,800 units of any motorcycle would take up a large amount of floor space and I understand Honda's need to play down such 'conspiracy' stories.
A simple photo would settle the argument...Is this proof?

[Old trials fanatic]

copemech, on 31 January 2012 - 04:20 AM, said:

Shut Up OTF! Fact is they screwed the Spanish and Martin as well! Reason why we do not have them here any longer.

Both have their points, and both are good guys and love trials! Let it be. Time will tell on the rest of things.

It is a FU situation!

My my arent you americans aggressive. Obviously caught a nerve or is it that american diplomacy is conducted with a big stick?

Why so touchy? If they "screwed" Martin why is he so strident and aggressive about this matter up for discussion?

You guys need to calm down over there and take a chill pill. No wonder the rest of the world worries so much.

BTW i do hope the FU reference doesnt refer to me as in the English speaking world that would be most offensive. Perhaps not over there from the tone of Martins posts. Whatever.

Edited by Old trials fanatic, 31 January 2012 - 01:56 PM.

[Steve Fracy]

Ham2, sadly you have mistaken that photo for something else. I believe that is actually Big Johns bike collection!

[HAM2]

Steve Fracy, on 31 January 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

Ham2, sadly you have mistaken that photo for something else. I believe that is actually Big Johns bike collection!

Apparently Big John's collection can be seen from the Space-Shuttle in orbit.. That photo?..that's from one of my all time favourite films.

[B40RT]

fat*******, on 31 January 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

I'm with Greeves on this.

I dont know one way or the other, but I would question the point of having the services of Mr Bou, if you have nothing to sell !

[Pete_Scorpa3]

B40RT, on 31 January 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

I dont know one way or the other, but I would question the point of having the services of Mr Bou, if you have nothing to sell !

Honda do love world champions!

[copemech]

Old trials fanatic, on 31 January 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

My my arent you americans aggressive. Obviously caught a nerve or is it that american diplomacy is conducted with a big stick?

Why so touchy? If they "screwed" Martin why is he so strident and aggressive about this matter up for discussion?

You guys need to calm down over there and take a chill pill. No wonder the rest of the world worries so much.

BTW i do hope the FU reference doesnt refer to me as in the English speaking world that would be most offensive. Perhaps not over there from the tone of Martins posts. Whatever.

OTF, I have retracted my original statement. I do think there was a bit of misunderstanding between Javier and Martin, and both share insight, yet if all these bikes are stored away, where are they? As agreed, time will tell.

Now YOU, with your rude insinuations of what Martin thinks true and his "non roumour mongering" comments described by you as "totally unacceptable" is another thing.

Americanizing it is even worse!

Now myself? I bust nuts and bolts on iron on a daily basis(and leak a fair amoun o blood in the process), I am no politician, and quite frankly I could giv a crap less what you think of me. I will give you a real job if you want it!

I am a friggin redneck if you want to Americanize that! And no, the FU was not against your sorry old ass,
just a comment about the situation.

Cheers,

[Old trials fanatic]

copemech, on 01 February 2012 - 04:51 AM, said:

OTF, I have retracted my original statement. I do think there was a bit of misunderstanding between Javier and Martin, and both share insight, yet if all these bikes are stored away, where are they? As agreed, time will tell.

Now YOU, with your rude insinuations of what Martin thinks true and his "non roumour mongering" comments described by you as "totally unacceptable" is another thing.

Americanizing it is even worse!

Now myself? I bust nuts and bolts on iron on a daily basis(and leak a fair amoun o blood in the process), I am no politician, and quite frankly I could giv a crap less what you think of me. I will give you a real job if you want it!

I am a friggin redneck if you want to Americanize that! And no, the FU was not against your sorry old ass,
just a comment about the situation.

Cheers,

Thanks for reinforceing the stereotype. Cheers

[Eddie_Lejeune]

B40RT, on 31 January 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

I dont know one way or the other, but I would question the point of having the services of Mr Bou, if you have nothing to sell !

The guts of 2000 05 4rt's apparently!

[copemech]

Old trials fanatic, on 01 February 2012 - 11:11 AM, said:

Thanks for reinforceing the stereotype. Cheers

One should never generalize! Poor taste!

[Old trials fanatic]

copemech, on 03 February 2012 - 06:09 AM, said:

One should never generalize! Poor taste!

Poor taste err I Quote "the FU was not against your sorry old ass"

Kettle pot black ?

Lets just agree to dissagree. You support your friends and their points of view and conduct and i'll support mine OK? Lifes too short. I hope you had a good "I bust nuts and bolts on iron on a daily basis(and leak a fair amoun o blood in the process), day.

cheers