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2000 Txt 280 Dragging Clutch


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#1 trialtrial

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 07:18 PM

The clutch on my 2000 TXT 280 is a real pain. Sure a little drag is fine, but this is too much, it stalls all the time and will not (at all) go into neutral. The hydraulics have all been rebuilt and bled. Its solid as a rock. I even worked on smoothing out the clucth basket. I pulled the plates and they are all within spec.

What else can I do? (besides buy another bike).

thanks


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#2 trialtrial

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 07:52 PM

I haven't tried ATF yet though. Will this help? Suggestions on brand/spec?

Edited by TrialTrial, 12 April 2012 - 07:53 PM.


#3 lewisallen

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 08:52 PM

I haven't tried ATF yet though. Will this help? Suggestions on brand/spec?


iv had a similar problem with regards to not getting neutral, i can get it if im rolling or engine is off, just something u get used to and as for the atf oil, i use motul dexron iii 750ml in my 2002 280 txt havnt tried anything else but thats what everyone seems to use on these bikes, other oils can make the plates swell, causing more dragg

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#4 sting32

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 09:42 PM

ATF might not help clutch & in gear, drag. I believe JSE has posted a bunch of times, in responses over the years, that Excessive dragging could be warped clutch plates, or something else. 700cc was what most manuals say, we used less, like 650cc. It only helps a little bit. you do get used to it, in trials situations, Im draggin the brake anyhow and slipping the clutch, so set your idle to idle when stopped, in gear, and clutch pulled. when in neutral it isnt that much faster of an idle, but it is a little.

that is what I do on the newer bikes. so what if it idles a little higher in neutral? your mileage can vary on that, depends on how much I guess.

Edited by Sting32, 12 April 2012 - 09:45 PM.

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#5 thats_a_five

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 12:57 AM

On my '94 JT250 (same basic engine as yours) , I had the same problem. I switched to ATF and the problem went away. I do find that it gradually drags more and more - then I drain and refill the ATF and its fixed. Clean fluid is the key.

Check the fluid when you drain it. If it is brownish it is just dirty. If it is thick and milky looking, you probably have a bad water pump seal which puts coolant in the oil. That will drag like crazy and also it's not a very good lubricant either.

#6 gasgas249uk

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 11:04 AM

Your Gas Gas 280 clutch basket spins on the shaft using a needle roller bearing

Ive recently discovered another mechanical reason why clutches drag ,but this is where the clutch baskets spin on a bush

Sorting it transforms the clutch immediately, with no drag at all.

When the clutch is pulled in , the clutch basket(thats driven by the crankshaft) stops transfering the power to the gear box by spinning on the shaft.

In time, what happens is that the bronze bush that the basket sits on becomes partially seized on the shaft or within the clutch basket. As a result the clutch basket literally has difficulty spinning on the shaft , so the gearbox is never disengaged and is always stressed. There is always drive to the gearbox and the clutch basket never spins properly and never works properly.

To establish if your bike has this problem, put your bike in 3rd gear and pull the clutch in with the engine OFF.

Try pushing the bike along. If your bike doesnt push along smoothly, then this is a clutch drag problem and it can be significantly improved and the drag eliminated

The tolerences where the bronze bush sits between the clutch basket and the shaft are very very tight. Ive found they can get tighter with age , not less, especially if the oil has not been changed regularly.

To rectify this problem remove your clutch side casing and check for the play that it has on the shaft .If there is not even the slightest bit , then this is your problem. For anything to move, slack is required(even new bearings have some play). Remove the basket and using an 800 wet and dry paper with plenty on wd40 lubrication work on the bronze bush to introduce a small amount of slack. Your basket should slide onto the shaft smoothly, with you having to push.It might take you an hour of wet and dry work evenly around the bush to get the slack just right.Your only taking off tiny amounts.

Reassemble with new ATF, light gear oil.

This transformed the clutch on a number of my bikes from having to drag , to none at all. The above mod allows the bike to be reversed with engine at idle in gear. What more can you ask.Now crack on chaps
Some bikes dont of course have the bronze bush and run on needle bearings. If this is the case , then this needs another solution.

Edited by gasgas249uk, 13 April 2012 - 12:18 PM.

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#7 trialtrial

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 04:54 PM

That's great info. It reminds me of a clutch drag problem that was happening with DR350s. I will tear the clutch down (again) and take a closer look. Then fill it with ATF.

#8 gasser_david

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Posted 13 April 2012 - 09:24 PM

For what it's worth.....
I've always used Putoline GP10 gear oil in my 2001 TXT 200 since.... 2001.... and never had any problems with dragging clutch or any other clutch / gearbox problems.
Some say that synthetic oil not a good idea...but works for me.
Have to add that also done the "beta" clutch mods as detailed in post on site before I came across the post.....gave the steel plates a good "going over" with orbital sander so that totally matt finish...only downside was clutch initially a bit "grabby" for first couple of hours until it "settled down".
As only a 160cc also took out 2 springs.... unsure if good idea with bigger engine.
Hope this helps
david

#9 dev1975

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 03:32 PM

hi had this with a husqvarna mx bike, plates looked fine but over time they get like sponges and just stick that bit too much even with clutch pulled in, replaced plates and problem solved

#10 moleman

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 04:53 PM

loosen the clutch aduster on the master cylinder lever right off and then using needle nose pliers, see if you can pull the piston out, if it comes out at all it may be the cause of your trouble there needs to be a good bit of slack for the piston to come right back and refill properly.
a sign that this is happening is that the lever can get stiff before touching the bars

if that is ok, then drop the oil and try the clutch with no oil in (ok for a minute or two ) if it still drags as bad with no oil in then no brand or grade of oil is going to fix the problem

then, if the two above have not sorted it (still with no oil in! ) loosen the outer smaller clutch cover and try again, the clutch runs very close and a small dent in the cover can stop the clutch fully releasing.
Moleman


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#11 trialtrial

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 03:33 AM

Thanks for the ideas guys. I will give it a go.




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