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hrmad

Has Enduro Or Trial Riding Helped?

34 posts in this topic

Hi, sorry the title should say 'trail'

Debating whether or not to swap my road bike for a road legal enduro or trail bike. I went to a trial today and it was way too hard for me, mainly because of the terrain getting between sections. Steep muddy hills, 5 mile lap, very steep drops too.

I lack aggression in my riding if that makes sense, I want to get comfortable with throwing the bike around and learn to use momentum more. I don't want to wear the trials bike out hence maybe getting something more suitable for longer distances.

I have no intentions of giving up, though I don't have much talent or hope I want to keep learning.

I know people say getting a trials bike improves their enduro riding, but is the opposite true? When you guys have gotten into trials has a enduro background helped?

thanks,

Heather

Edited by hrmad

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Don't want these Ads? Why not sign up as a Trials Central Supporter.

Enduro bikes are great for good/aggressive riders. If you think getting up a muddy hill is hard on a trials bike then it's more difficult on an enduro bike as, if you get in to trouble, the seat height prevents you getting a good push from a dab (I have a few seasons of enduro riding years ago on which I base this opinion). On the other hand modern trials bikes are harder than twinshocks to get up muddy hills as you can't sit down to get weight over the back wheel once you are struggling.

There's a knack to riding mud - I would suggest better value for the money than buying another bike is to give yourself a birthday treat and attend a Steve Saunders school - nobody rides mud better than he.

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Enduro bikes are great for good/aggressive riders. If you think getting up a muddy hill is hard on a trials bike then it's more difficult on an enduro bike as, if you get in to trouble, the seat height prevents you getting a good push from a dab (I have a few seasons of enduro riding years ago on which I base this opinion). On the other hand modern trials bikes are harder than twinshocks to get up muddy hills as you can't sit down to get weight over the back wheel once you are struggling.

There's a knack to riding mud - I would suggest better value for the money than buying another bike is to give yourself a birthday treat and attend a Steve Saunders school - nobody rides mud better than he.

Thanks for the advice. Maybe I should mix up slow practice with some higher speed stuff too when out on the bike. I just feel frustrated, I'm not a naturally gifted rider by any stretch of the imagination and some of the other riders make it look so easy. But I'll keep trying, I'll have to save up for Steve Saunders :)

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You almost answered you own question. You have been learning to ride slow as in a section. You need to mix it up and just go ride some trails! A 5 mile loop is a good long ride for a beginner. My daughters confidence grew after a few long trail rides. She did not clean the loop, but she rode harder things just because it was part of the trail.

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I suppose I could get the bike an M.O.T, find a way to make a seat and carry extra fuel. I could do some trail riding on it within an hour from home, load it in the van and just minimize road work.

Plus do some fast work during practice. Lineaway, sorry, got a habit of doing that :D If it boosted your daughters confidence it sounds like it's worth trying.

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My Rotten youngest son (the one with the trick reflex... ) has found that he likes to go fast ... And @ 15 he flat hauls a$$ on the trails on a Reflex that I've set up to be the best trials bike I can make out of it .... Kinda p****s me off because as of now his new one peice seat/tank unit has been center punched and leaks fuel slowly ... (but dad I didn't do it !!!)

Anyways I digress , once you get used to the twitchy high speed handling of a trials bike , you'll be amazed at how easy they can motivate down a trail , You just have to remember , they respond MUCH quicker and more to the slightest body inputs . But at my age I tend to just cruise at a decent clip between sections these days .

Glenn

Edited by axulsuv
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I would not bother about wearing your trials bike out, properly maintained they wear pretty well, probably less effort and cost than running a second bike.

Riding an MX or Enduro bike does help with trials, as does riding a trials bike help with Enduro and MX.

The more time you spend on any off road bike the more it builds up your skill and fitness.

Even grass tracking which is basically just going round in circles builds your skill, throttle control and confidence.

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Thanks for the responses guys. My biggest problem is lack of confidence, and it's affecting every aspect of my riding.

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I wouldn't go for an endure bike to build your confidence at speed. I found even on my EC200 you quickly realize it is a race bike and it if you don't like flying through the woods it will scare you more than anything. My suggestion would be a light trail bike like a crf100 or 150 - they can be a pile of fun and a real confidence booster just blasting around trails.

I would warn you that dirt biking at speed on a trials bike is not ideal as demonstrated in this short clip of a guy on my EC200 chasing me on my 200 txt... I will say that falling off is the best way to build confidence and it is way more fun on a trials buike or a small trail bike than a race bike (I think I have done it enough to know).

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I wouldn't go for an endure bike to build your confidence at speed. I found even on my EC200 you quickly realize it is a race bike and it if you don't like flying through the woods it will scare you more than anything. My suggestion would be a light trail bike like a crf100 or 150 - they can be a pile of fun and a real confidence booster just blasting around trails.

I would warn you that dirt biking at speed on a trials bike is not ideal as demonstrated in this short clip of a guy on my EC200 chasing me on my 200 txt... I will say that falling off is the best way to build confidence and it is way more fun on a trials buike or a small trail bike than a race bike (I think I have done it enough to know).

That was a proper face plant, looked like it hurt!

I did a bit of light green laning before I got the trials bike, but I think it did more harm than good. It was on an xr 125 with road tyres, I lost a lot of confidence coming off a lot and having no grip. I think that has carried over a bit. I suppose I can't expect miracles, I've only been riding a road bike for just over a year, trials 4 months or so.

It's going to take a long time to get the hang of it, the slow stuff is coming along well though. What I meant by speed on the trials bike was more about getting momentum on big hills and confidence on descents rather than high speed cornering like your friend attempted ;) The best option does seem to be to make a long range kit for the beta, time to search the forum. No way I can afford the official beta one!

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That wasn't my friend that was ME! ... my friend was kind enough not to name me when he posted it to youtube... but mistakes are really the only thing you can call your own (and I don't really remember it hurting I was having too much fun). I had a similar crash on the EC200 at a hare scramble race and that extra 50lbs landing on you really does make a difference :(.

I have seen little pillow type seats that some people use on their bikes at the 6 days might be a start. I will see if I can find a link.

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I think they complement each other as any "clutch/seat" time gives more experience.

If we take my wife's motorcycle journey...

She started a year ago on her Beta 250 4T. It was a quest to get her motorcycle licence so I insisted she had to start on trials bike. This gave her the balance needed to ride a bike well but didn't really prep her for the dangers of the road... high speed corners, wet slippery roundabouts, light speed direction changes (cagers coming over on you or pulling out on you).

To that end I purchased a Yamaha WR250 but it was too intimidating with its high seat position and 27hp! So I then purchased a Yamaha XT250 4T for her and she loves it. Came off a few times but in general she gained much experience for the road riding tight trails in wooded areas. Of course I had to keep the WR for myself and get a Montesa Cota for trials!

There is about a dozen of us with trail bikes heading to a working cattle station at Easter. The station allows motorcycles and we are taking the trail bikes as there are 20k, 30k and 60k loops. I may chuck in the Beta for a bit of trials near the camp.... and the camp competition everyone in with $10, longest static balance gets the pot? None of them can static very well!!! They are all high speed motocross riders. The only female rider is my wife all other partners sit in camp while we ride the loops. She will gain great experience riding these trials every day for 6 hrs a day for 4 days.

My wife is now a confirmed road rider but she still does her static on the Beta to improve her balance even more. Her bike of choice is the trials bike and the comps are so hard she nearly gave up trials but she is determined to do her first "clean" 40 in novice. The trials bike is going nowhere... she loves the thing.

We alternated on practice days with one day using the trials bikes and the next the enduro but these days (a year later) we take the trials bikes 3 times to one enduro day. So I'd say mostly trials but chuck in some enduro if you can do it. My wife has at a 3 year plan to be able to clean novice... it may take 4, everyone goes at their own speed. FUN is the name of the game and you learn some trials along the way!

Trials IS NOT EASY... it takes time and good skills grounding. Ask anyone... it doesn't happen in a year, two, three???? Some that seriously start later in life like me and only playing with social trials a couple of years when a young lad, will never develop the skills of you younger riders. Go at your own pace and dont hesitate to drop back to basic skills practice, its the grounding of all techniques.

This will give you an idea of just static training let alone" motor on" skills....

I was talking to a national trials champion about static balance time and how often... he told me a story... When he started trials as a youngster the Simpsons TV show had started. He would line his bike up in front of the TV and when the shows music started he climbed up on the bike... when the credits rolled he stepped down off the bike. Thats 30 mins of static none stop.

I asked how often he did it... he replied "Every night the Simpsons was on". The simpsons ran here 5 nights a week.

I'm not saying do that much static but you can see the dedication needed in all areas of riding trials. If he was doing that much motor off imagine how much motor on! We all dont want (or cant) to be champions but you can see it may take differing times for individuals to learn skills to a certain level.

I get frustrated with not getting ahead and think (for example)... Geez! This double blip will be the death of me and I'll burn the bloody thing... while it is lying there just open the tank cap and chuck a match on... get in car and drive home to cold beer... but I keep coming back..Hehehehehee.

Confidence comes from time and good skills grounding. If you want to step out on the edge and try something you are not fully confident at... dont forget to be safe! Just as an example...Have a minder each side of you as you go up a non-comfort zone steep bank for example... they can grab you if you get outta shape. The club practice days are invaluable for this.

I think you are way ahead of the game considering you have been on two wheels for just over year!!! For your short time on the bike I dont think you realise how good you are... I cant static with my hands off the bars for a start.... smarty pants youngsters!!!! Wink

Mags

Edited by mags
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Thanks and sorry Michael_T didn't realise it was you crashing! The link has given me some ideas, maybe if I get a jerry can like this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/151535745802?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT strap it to the bike, probably in the middle. Then buy a seat for maybe a twinshock bike or pick something up in a local auctions, get some velco strips or something or straps. You could do it for under 40-50 pounds. It might look terrible, but who cares?

Mags, Thanks for the encouragement. Your wife is awesome, my mum is around her age and she wouldn't touch a road bike with a stick, let alone a trials bike. Hats off to her, she's doing amazing. Road riding is fun, blasting past cars, seeing how fast you dare enter a corner, trying to get really smooth on the controls and of course, being switched on to what cars are doing and what the conditions are like 100% of the time. I've always wanted a WR, maybe in the future if I can afford one and when I feel more confident on the trials bike.

And yes, a fella told me at the trial I went to last Sunday, it takes years. The ones who seem to move up quickly are the teenagers. So it will be back to basics for me, and practising hill climbs and descents with my riding buddy. It's not only how balanced you are and how you control the bike, mental confidence and commitment to getting up that hill, or down it or over an obstacle is the make or break aspect. I'll just keep practising and relax a bit more, thanks :)

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I would be tempted to just get out the old sewing machine and some decent foam and try making a little pillow and attaching it with Velcro like this...

beta.JPG

Edited by michael_t

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