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motovita

199A Setup

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 I've made my beat up old 199A my only Trials bike and I'm enjoying riding it. I've had it for years but only ridden, and worked on it occasionally. I'm drawn to the Bultaco because I raced on them when in my prime. I don't want to make it into a modern bike but I think with some upgrades and riding it regularly I can make it work pretty well. Old age and decrepitude have relegated me to a lower class in club Trials and I find a vintage bike makes that move more palatable.

 I'm considering a couple of changes and would like to hear comments and advice.

 First, my airbox and side panels are hanging on by a thread. I think I recall seeing 199s with older airboxes and side panels but I can't remember what model parts were used and don't know if they would be available. I'm running the stock type Bing now but I expect I'll switch to a VM Mikuni at some point, to my eyes flat slide carbs just look wrong on a Bultaco.

 Second, I'm wondering about using Pursang or other triple clamps to take some twitch out of the front end, I'm running longer rear shocks. Are there riders here that have done that? Would I lose significant steering lock? Or has anyone bored out the top clamp and found a different fork and front wheel to use? A stronger front brake would be welcome.

 

Edited by motovita

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Hi motovita,

I note you are using longer rear shocks this will quicken up the steering a little which may suit you, or it might be affecting the ride. My 199A had the older and larger air box fitted when I got the bike from Italy, this was a mod carried out to improve torque. In my opinion it gave the engine better breathing as the correct air box could stifle the engine when working hard. The side panels will need to be from the same older bike too. The waterproofing was pants so I set to and made sure that the only way water could get in was if the bike went in above the lower seat line. I may be corrected by more knowledgeable members, but if you look at model 159 onwards you will see the larger side panels. The smaller side panels Inprefer the look of. If you would like to see pics of my 199A with the larger air box and side panels pm me and I’ll see if I can send some to you. 🙂👍With regard to the motor cross fork triple clamps this will slow the steering i.e. increase trail which should increase high speed stability not really what you want for trials riding.

Edited by section swept
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i can tell you my 199a setup: try first 35 or cm rear shocks and the right springs for your weight. put all shims or spacers out of the front fork and make it soft with automatic transmission fluid. 26 Dellorto, original airbox. I have cut away the outer flywheel mass to make the engine more light. (wheelies more easy now) at last the footrests cut off and welded 1,5cm more to the rear.  find your own ignition point...there is a range...

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Some people do use Pursang/late Alpina/Frontera triple clamps on their Sherpa Ts to increase trail, but beware that the front guard may then hit the exhaust pipe if it is a standard exhaust header. I didn't notice what was done with the steering stops and haven't tried it myself.

I like the way standard late model Sherpa Ts steer when the suspension is set correctly so am not tempted to make changes.

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44 minutes ago, feetupfun said:

Some people do use Pursang/late Alpina/Frontera triple clamps on their Sherpa Ts to increase trail, but beware that the front guard may then hit the exhaust pipe if it is a standard exhaust header. I didn't notice what was done with the steering stops and haven't tried it myself.

I like the way standard late model Sherpa Ts steer when the suspension is set correctly so am not tempted to make changes.

 Thanks for pointing out the pipe clearance issue, I wasn't thinking of that. That's why I like to ask about these things.

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i would say, there is no difference between sherpa and alpina exhaust pipes. may be for better brake you can try the alpina front wheel. i think 135mm. Alpina has different steering stops located at the triple clamps. you must weld one stop at the middle of steering head or try the old ones.

IMG_7157.JPG

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The older airbox would be from the model 159,183,191 style.  These have one sidepanel as part of the airbox and the other is the airbox lid.  Photo of one from a model 191 attached.

DSC_0133.JPG

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43 minutes ago, dr-alpina said:

i would say, there is no difference between sherpa and alpina exhaust pipes. may be for better brake you can try the alpina front wheel.

That's true that the exhaust header is probably the same shape, but the Alpina frame on some of the models with the Pursang triple clamps is different to the M199 and M199A Sherpa T frames and those same Alpina models have longer fork tubes than the Sherpa T, which increases the clearance to the exhaust.

I have a M138 which is one of the Alpina models with the Pursang/Frontera triple clamps and preventing the front mudguard from touching the exhaust (and also making sure the front tyre knobs miss the mudguard on full compression of the forks requires a great deal of care when setting it up.

Yes the bigger Alpina/Frontera front hub/brakes are amazing, but are a fair bit heavier than the Sherpa T front hub/brakes

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If you want to really improve the brakes on a Sherpa T then you have to have a cast iron liner or just an iron liner installed. This improves the brakes heaps. I have a M199 with NJB 395mm shocks on the rear (TLR Honda) and it handles fine. This bike won the open class in the Twinshock Masters Trial (Queensland, Australia) last year so it handles well. The only other change on it is the footpegs are Apico alloy ones and the brackets are moved back and down about half an inch. Stay with the standard Yokes or triple clamps. The airbox you are after is the 158,159 up to the 190, 191. Graham.

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 Thanks guys,

 You've convinced me not to mess with the triple clamps.

 I've moved the foot peg mounts and am using modern pegs. My rear wheel has a steel or iron liner, it looks quite worn though, the front still has the original chrome intact. The backing plates are worn, I'm sure the brakes I have can be improved with some work. I'm running a left side brake pedal that was on the bike when I got it, that works well for me as my particular disability involves my right foot and leg. After the last Trial a friend who lives out of town stayed over and we went trail riding on our Enduro bikes the next day, when riding through the rocks I found myself trying repeatedly to find the rear brake with my left foot.

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 Another question has come to mind. Does anyone run a 2.15 (WM3) rear rim on a Sherpa T? It's a very tight fit between the muffler and the chain guard, I'm concerned about clearance. The old rim is working for now but I've destroyed enough Akronts to know it likely won't last. I've already replaced the front.

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The air filter from the 199b can be fitted in the 199a air box, because the b filter is cylindrical it offers a bigger surface area than the flat one fitted to the a. In my opinion leave the yokes alone unless like me you are quite tall and find the riding position cramped, if so there are a couple of aftermarket top yokes available with the bars mounted over the steering stem.

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1 hour ago, trialsrfun said:

The air filter from the 199b can be fitted in the 199a air box, because the b filter is cylindrical it offers a bigger surface area than the flat one fitted to the a. In my opinion leave the yokes alone unless like me you are quite tall and find the riding position cramped, if so there are a couple of aftermarket top yokes available with the bars mounted over the steering stem.

 I am rather tall and the top clamp sounds interesting, can you direct me to a source? I haven't seen one with the tapered bore for these forks.

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