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dadof2

One For The Americans

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40 minutes ago, turbofurball said:

No, they wanted to sell/give them to businesses ...

Congress doing stuff in January

And in April, Trump doing stuff

(this is just what came up with a quick google)

Same lands.  Obama put into law the Wilderness act that closed most of it off to anyone.  It was a pretty screwed up deal, affected a lot of recreational use.

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Yeah, but then selling it off for mining and drilling for oil isn't helpful in the long term either ...

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19 hours ago, turbofurball said:

Yeah, but then selling it off for mining and drilling for oil isn't helpful in the long term either ...

Ironically, in many places, they sell assetts on public lands, specifically timber.  The govt doesn't sell all the land involved.  Trump sometimes runs a divide and conquer approach.  I can not say for certain, but if I recall correctly, this land sale idea / proposal was about the same time as the pipeline.  The enviro people made the huge focus to have no pipeline, The Trump team, added another element, almost a warning shot across the bow.  Enviro people do not own the entire country nor can they expect unrealistic immediate change.  Possibly the idea of pipeline or sell natural areas was a planned play to the enviro tactics.  Just speculating.

 

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I don't think environmentalists wanted change, they wanted things to not change ... given the failure rate of existing pipelines, and that they've caused lots of damage, it doesn't seem unreasonable to resist their installation

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On 2017-6-4 at 1:13 AM, dadof2 said:

Wow, light the blue touchpaper and stand back! I never expected anything like this when I made the original post.

I quite like Donald's approach to things especially his decision to disregard the Paris agreement.

 

On 2017-6-5 at 1:34 AM, steveo said:

 

Have you read even some of the proposals of what this accord stated.

First off, the Paris accord never passed in Congress.

Therefore all Trump did was pull America away from the table.

He has stated this agreement negotiated by Obama is not in the interests of America, and he would look at renegotiating another agreement to better protect the American people.

Trump, by signing up would have committed America to drastically reduce its emissions now, but China and India, the biggest polluters in the world, can continually increase their emissions to 2030 at which time they may or may not agree to comply with the agreement.

India, before it makes up its mind, demands to be paid 2.5 trillion dollars

America have to reduce their coal production.

China and India does not and can increase it.

Russia can actually increase its emissions by 50%.

.America, along with the rest of the developed world, have to pay hundreds of millions dollars into the UN climate fund with no guarantees that any other than the United State would do it.
 
Given their existing track record with NATO and the UN, who would police it when they have not contributed their 2% GDP contributions  of which Trump made them well aware of at his recent meeting.
 
With just these couple of examples, in what way does this benefit the United States? 
 
The above requirements isn’t an agreement, it is little less than extortion of the United States workers and taxpayers.
 
When China and India get serious about reducing carbon emissions with a good starting point being the cleaning up New Dehli and Beijing maybe America would then get interested and come back to the table.

The US.... On its own has greatly reduced it's green house emissions and carbon footprint... While others nations have not and yet America still gets the finger pointed at them.
 
How can a climate change policy that is loaded against the interests of his country that he is responsible for and in its current form is little more than a one way street to extortion.

 

On 2017-6-5 at 2:32 PM, pmk said:

Steveo brings the facts not the gossip.  

Hogwash, the Paris agreement is non binding.
It seems that Steveo, just like Trump, only likes to share the parts of the agreement that suit him.

Or did you not read the entire agreement, Steveo? 

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On ‎10‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 5:02 AM, guys said:

 

 

Hogwash, the Paris agreement is non binding.
It seems that Steveo, just like Trump, only likes to share the parts of the agreement that suit him.

Or did you not read the entire agreement, Steveo? 

Yeah, like earlier on in the piece when non binding and selectively shared scientific evidence Gore used in these debates regarding rising carbon emission levels.  Much of his earth shattering claims have since been found to be way off the mark but was instrumental in making him a squillion. Sharing facts that are true is usually the best way to get a point across when the MSM and others that rely on their omission to play their games deceit.. America and Australia were the only 2 major Industrialized Nations that did not ratify the Kyoto agreement add to that the shambles of the Copenhagen conference and the outcome of both these earlier agreements has been mediocre to say the least.  The Paris agreement is in theory a positive plan and the Trump administration has indicated that it will enter into it on terms that do not require American dollars and American job losses to carry the load.
Thanks for the compliment..:D

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You're still full of bull****.

"Sharing facts that are true is usually the best way to get a point across"

Here's a fact that's true:
Non binding means non binding; Trump and the US could do whatever they wanted when they stayed in the Paris agreement.
You fell for the scaremongering of the dumbest president, in US history.

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10 hours ago, guys said:

You're still full of bull****.

"Sharing facts that are true is usually the best way to get a point across"

Here's a fact that's true:
Non binding means non binding; Trump and the US could do whatever they wanted when they stayed in the Paris agreement.
You fell for the scaremongering of the dumbest president, in US history.

So let me get this straight.  The USA could have remained within the Paris Agreement, and then not abided by any of it if the USA decided that was best.

So, based on the fact the USA stepped away from the Paris Agreement, what benefit was there to remain in the agreement and simply not abide by the rules of the agreement?

Mr Guy, somehow I sense you have a deep hatred for the USA and regardless of who became or becomes President, you will not be content or happy.

I live in the USA, my family has lived in North America before the USA existed.  Being here, first hand, without even reading or watching the news the problems can be witnessed.  

Why do you Mr Guy have such hatred for the USA and what seems like other people overall?

If President Trump does utilize US taxpayer money here at home vs sending it to other countries that ask people both here and outside the USA will see that.  Improving things at home is important, to many citizens.  I have beleif that President Trump, as he initiates these new infrastructure plans will follow guidelines or similar guidelines to the Paris Agreement without the added expense and without others derailing progress to improve.

I am excited to see how quickly the remaining Paris Agreement countries move forward, in their efforts to improve the entire world.  Maybe in 6 months we should revisit this Paris Agreement and place facts into our posts that demonstrate true progress, not simply talk.

Edited by pmk
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10 hours ago, guys said:

You're still full of bull****.

"Sharing facts that are true is usually the best way to get a point across"

Here's a fact that's true:
Non binding means non binding; Trump and the US could do whatever they wanted when they stayed in the Paris agreement.
You fell for the scaremongering of the dumbest president, in US history.

My views were well in place before the arrival of Trump and I support the courage he shows as he faces such obstruction from fools who can not see the big picture he is such a threat too.
 
What is plain to see from your posts is your support of the actions and directions being taken by many spineless Western leaders who are not representing the best interests of their own countries..
 
You fit in well with them as being the epitome of xenocentrism.
 
Edited by steveo
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54 minutes ago, pmk said:

So let me get this straight.  The USA could have remained within the Paris Agreement, and then not abided by any of it if the USA decided that was best.

So, based on the fact the USA stepped away from the Paris Agreement, what benefit was there to remain in the agreement and simply not abide by the rules of the agreement?

Mr Guy, somehow I sense you have a deep hatred for the USA and regardless of who became or becomes President, you will not be content or happy.

I live in the USA, my family has lived in North America before the USA existed.  Being here, first hand, without even reading or watching the news the problems can be witnessed.  

Why do you Mr Guy have such hatred for the USA and what seems like other people overall?

If President Trump does utilize US taxpayer money here at home vs sending it to other countries that ask people both here and outside the USA will see that.  Improving things at home is important, to many citizens.  I have beleif that President Trump, as he initiates these new infrastructure plans will follow guidelines or similar guidelines to the Paris Agreement without the added expense and without others derailing progress to improve.

I am excited to see how quickly the remaining Paris Agreement countries move forward, in their efforts to improve the entire world.  Maybe in 6 months we should revisit this Paris Agreement and place facts into our posts that demonstrate true progress, not simply talk.

Nope, don't hate America, and certainly not its citizens.
I do hate the industrial war machine, America has become since WW2.

And no, I don't claim to be able to predict the future, I don't know what the difference between in or out the Paris agreement in the future will bring.
But neither does Steveo, even though his page long assumptions seem to suggest he does.

I do hate a demagogue like Trump.
This is one of his quotes on the subject:
“Thus, as of today, the United States will cease all implementation of the nonbinding Paris accord and the draconian financial and economic burdens the agreement imposes on our country.”

That is a blatant lie, perpetuated by Steveo, and it's not the only one, look it up.

Edited by guys

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5 minutes ago, guys said:

Nope, don't hate America, and certainly not its citizens.
I do hate the industrial war machine, America has become since WW2.

And no, I don't claim to be able to predict the future, I don't know what the difference between in or out the Paris agreement in the future will bring.
But neither does Steveo, even though his page long assumptions seem to suggest he does.

I do hate a demagogue like Trump.
This is one of his quotes on the subject:
“Thus, as of today, the United States will cease all implementation of the nonbinding Paris accord and the draconian financial and economic burdens the agreement imposes on our country.”

That is a blatent lie, perpetuated by Steveo, and it's not the only one, look it up.

That USA war machine that you hate, is the same one that may have helped your country in WWII.  

What has happened since then, was likely influenced by input from other countries either needing and asking for help, or other world leaders pointing to wrongs they expected to be corrected.

When the USA reels its forces back home, along with other countries pulling back their troops and lets the countries fight for themselves, unless they are proven allies, it is possible then, and only then will we know if any country that has deployed troops to the Middle East made an error in judgement.  At that point the war machine from outside sources may wind down, but internally the humanitarions may have a crisis well beyond control.

My personal opinion, the Middle East has no true benefit economically to the USA.  Indirectly though, it offers opportunity to monitor threats, and also lets this incredibly technical war machine as you referred to it, evaluate technolgy.

The USA defense program will never stop improving its capabilities.  The entire world is a technology arena.  You, the news media, the general public has no idea of the true capability of both the USA and Russia.  The world may consider North Korea a threat.  I would be very surprised to see NK launch any threat that was not thwarted onto their own country.

The war machine you hate, many Americans hate also, not for the might or sacrafice it posses and endures, but rather that it suffers these losses for many in conflicts not truly protecting the USA.  As the USA steps back, it will be interesting to see other countries, including Belgium become involved for the sake of humanity.  

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6 hours ago, steveo said:
My views were well in place before the arrival of Trump and I support the courage he shows as he faces such obstruction from fools who can not see the big picture he is such a threat too.
 
What is plain to see from your posts is your support of the actions and directions being taken by many spineless Western leaders who are not representing the best interests of their own countries..
 
You fit in well with them as being the epitome of xenocentrism.
 

"I support the courage he shows"
That's a good one. He doesn't even have the courage to show his tax returns.
He doesn't keep his own promises. That's a coward in my book, or someone who's got something to hide. Or am I missing "the big picture" Steveo?

What's your prediction on the budget talks Steveo? Is Trump going to make America great againg for the poor, the sick and the elderly? Or mainly for his family, his businesses and his rich friends?

Edited by guys

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Steveo: "You fit in well with them as being the epitome of xenocentrism. "

 

I think that Belgium, my home country (born and bred), is one of the best places to live.

Isn't that the antonym of xenocentrism Steveo?

 

I love this topic! I'm learning new fancy words every day.

Edited by guys

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This would be Donald "I dodged the draft twice" Trump who is supposed to be brave now?  The one who took the mick out of the parents of a dead serviceman?  The one who won't even visit here in case protesters hurt his feelings?

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Please check your balls at the door, because the brave leader needs an ego boost.

Warning: X-rated content; the brave leader can be seen stroking his own ego.

 

 

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