Hi Boffins just joined what i hope to be the best forum for info exchange and problem solving 

So can anyone tell me why my Bultaco sherpa M80 has what seems to be original front lower engine mountings ground off .... ?

2 extra mountings on the upper frame for no apparent reason

and finally the letter G stamped on the headstock ?.... have included pics very interested to read yr views chaps

Best regards 

Frank

could it have had a pursang engine fitted at some point?  or another alternative motor?

Yes thats a possibillity but i have a letter of authenticity from bultaco written in 94 confirming its a 1972 250 sherpa and those lower brackets were factory welds they are too uniform for after market do it yourself  ..could be a production line mistake i suppose ..or a design team prototype hence the letter G stamped on the frame ??

They aren't engine mounts that have been removed, the lower front engine mount, where fitted (not on 5 speed trials engines) is central so where something has been removed is the wrong place for a front lower engine mount. It's possibly had case savers welded on at some point which may have been removed.

Can't help with the upper mounts as I can't really see them from the pictures but the M80 doesn't  have brackets there.It's nearly 50 years old so unless you know the history, previous owners could have fitted all manner of things.

No idea what the G is, never seen that before, could signify the country it was exported to if not a UK bike originally?

Ok its had 2 owners on the v5 so i may be able to research through them definitely a uk bike with 2 side stands (left hand on the frame right hand on the swinging arm ) maybe the swing arm is from a different bike ...it has a kit campeon tank which doesn't fit correctly because of the top of frame mountain...i would hate to cut them off if its the wrong tank 

Edited July 8, 20188 yr by Frankness

8 minutes ago, Frankness said:

Ok its had 2 owners on the v5 so i may be able to research through them definitely a uk bike with 2 side stands (left hand on the frame right hand on the swinging arm ) maybe the swing arm is from a different bike ...it has a kit campeon tank which doesn't fit correctly because of the top of frame mountain...i would hate to cut them off if its the wrong tank 

"top of the frame mountain"? If you mean those non-standard mounting lugs, they are definitely non-standard and yes they would be in the way of an M80 fuel tank. Would it help for you to see what a standard series 1 M80 frame looks like?

A stand mount on the swingarm is also non-standard for a series 1 M80 but would be a great improvement if done properly.

Ha ha yes indeed mounting ... and yes a series 1 m80 frame pic would be helpful thanks ...any ideas on the letter G ..i've had a few Bultacos over the years none with any letters on the frame head stock

My late model 49 has a G stamped in the same spot I don’t know what it means but we could always make up a story that it means Works Super Special but really it probably means George stamped it as it left the factory 

Looks to me your original frame mounted sidestand bracket is on the right side

 if the swing arm bracket is on the opposite side the bracket would have been welded on later I’m pretty sure no Bultaco had a stand on the chain side

Those mounting lugs are interesting are they buffer mounts like the ones behind the headstock you’d have to wonder what sort of tank/seat it had on it. They are not even opposite each other.

Ha ha make up a story like a bike dealer you mean ..there were some twin side stand models but they were comerfords but this certainly isn't one of them ..although the guy selling it to me did try it on with a side note in the paperwork ... i might have believed him if he'd spelt it correctly it read cummerferds .... i like the m49 its a sweet looking bike ..mine came with a spare m49 seat and tank but i suspect thats a lobito 

23 hours ago, Frankness said:

 those lower brackets were factory welds they are too uniform for after market do it yourself  .

From my experiance of original Bultaco factory welding I would suggest if the weld are uniform and good it rules out original factory welding.......

My M80 has a frame number 749 less than yours, it does not have any of the lugs pointed out. No G on the headstock But I have seen various letters on other Bultaco headstocks so would not read to much into this. In the first picture there is a bracket on the cente line foward of the main downtube. My M80 does not have this bracket. Later bikes had a head brace bolted to a bracket in this area  (but more foward) to brace the frame. The downtube on the M80 is along way back so a brace back to this point so in my oppinion would not be very affective.

Stuart

Edited July 8, 20188 yr by twinnshock
spelling

Yes i've witnessed Spanish workmanship first hand yr right .... do you think they called it an M80 because its the same weight as the yugoslavian M80 tank ? ...hopefully mine is full of gold ...... maybe drug dealers stamped letters on the bikes stuffed with cocaine ...now there is a dealer story ..lol

This is a series 1 M80 frame with the tank resting in place

Well my M80 frame doesn’t have any other markings or lugs. Could this have been a special order for a sidecar adapted bike.? The tank unit would fit if the necessary holes had been made in the sides of seat base/cover panels, assuming it used the original Kit Campione unit. They could also have been to securely locate tools and spares for something like the SSDT. Still think it was modded to accept a sidecar, smaller lug may have been for a passenger grab handle. Now all we need is a Bultaco sidecar expert and the murder ...I mean mystery will be solved???

Edited July 19, 20188 yr by section swept

So just by pure chance waiting for a burger at Goodwood a proper old chap standing next to me had a Bultaco T shirt on ... got chatting like you do 

he said might be a design team prototype as it has the letter G  stamped on the head ..or made to look like one he said the best way to tell is by weight prototypes were heavier ...mine is very heavy ........ he could have been pulling my chain though 

Do you really believe if the factory made a prototype they would make it heavier than standard ?

No way - much more likely the extra lugs were added by a previous owner  for sidecar use. The early frames are very heavy anyway owing to the quality of tubing used. I've heard this referred to as "gas pipe" and the like by knockers, but it was all that was available to the factory at the time.