mrmikkelsen

Darn it, out of upload capacity, and I have two more pics to post. I've been riding the bike a bit now. The footing position still needed to be just a tad more rearward to get the front end feeling neutral and easier to lift. I welded on footpeg extension to the back side of the pegs to widen the pegs into more modern proportions and the balance of the bike feels right. Also, I was getting as much steering turn as I wanted, 15 degrees less than the TY175 seemed to be the issue. The fork legs were bottoming against the tank. I didn't want to swap for something like CR250M triples that stick way out, so instead I grabbed a section of 1 1/4" chromemolly frame tubing and used it flatten the front edges of the tank. The bars now to the same degrees of rotation as the TY and it steers much better through the tight trials type corners I've been practicing on. Unfortunately this was post-painting. I taped over the area before shaping though so paint damage was minimal, and I used some DupliColor Chevy Orange engine paint to touch it up- a surprisingly close match to the two-part automotive Flash Red used otherwise. Fun bike, much more grunt than the TY175, taller to suit my 6' height well. I'm only getting about 1/2 kickstarter stroke until bottoming on the footpeg, but thankfully that seems to be plenty to get her running. Now the only problem is figuring out which one of these fun bikes should I keep and which one should I sell.

Well, I was going to put a bunch of detail pictures up here but it looks like I've reached my upload limit. Fitting I guess. Here's the last one that fits, the top view with the narrow side panels, tank rear cover, 1979 pennies capping frame rails all proudly in view.

Three and half years this thing has been in my work space, several other bikes have come in later and gone out sooner, but finally this one is done too. It fired up today and sounds like a brand new bike. I removed a bunch of brush on one side of our house to make a trails area, and I can't wait to get out there and learn how to ride trials.

I really like your tank color scheme, it looks classic British. One of those TLR kickers would be nice to have too. I get about 1/2 stroke with the stock kicker before it stops on the rear mounted footpeg. The single shock xl suspension sounds perfect for trials too. Soft & cushy, and springy enough with the damping adjustability. Nice rig.

A local decal guy made me some stickers pretty close to the originals. The white border isn't true to the originals, but it allowed him to stack the layers of colors easier. I need to find a tough clear overlay as these are quite thin and I'd like them to last. Is there anything better than plain old contact paper? The front brake cable is too long since it is designed to go around all the lighting and instrument stuff that this bike no longer has. Flander's still supplies cable ends, so I ordered some and plan to shorten the cables. We used to make cables in the shop where I worked decades ago, so hopefully I can get that done. I need to revalve and respring the shocks and I don't know a hill of beans about trials damping. I have a ty175, so I guess I'll try to make the shocks feel more or less like those? Light on the damping and light on the springs sounds about right. If anybody is actually following this old thread and knows something about trials shocks I'd love to hear your thoughts.

I know it is a tiny step, but the front fender really makes it look more complete to me, so here it is. The control cables are way too long. What is the go to place to buy solder-on cable ends so I can shorten the cables?

The custom 15x37x12 bearings finally came in all the way from China so the original front wheel can work with the bigger axle forks. $20 and the local M&M Machine shop kindly bored out the backing plate to match. My brazing job on the front fender mount broke when I tried to bend the tab so the fender would fit right. I guess it is good to catch sub-standard work before it causes a failure in the field, eh? A careful eye can spot that the side stand is now on the swingarm instead of its original spot on the frame. That frame spot is now taken by the rear set footpegs so the stand had to go elsewhere. The stand is about 5" or so longer now, two stands are grafted together to make the one long one. I hope the spring is strong enough to keep the longer stand in position while riding. Remaining is the drive chain guide, reworking the shocks, sorting the rear brake pedal, front fender mount, and little details.

While I'm here, here's a picture of the motor in process. The engine covers were painted silver stock, but I know I'll beat it up and make any paint look awful. The new CRF's come with bare metal engine covers, so I stripped the paint, cleaned the parts with an acid solution designed to pre-clean aluminum before welding. They look like they just came off of the casting machine on the production line. The hardware all went out to Hayward Electroplating for a fresh zinc coating. That's the best $150 ever spent on a restoration, spokes, bolts, clips, everything looks brand new for what amounts to not a whole lot of money. The rod small end bearing was seized so it got a new rod kit. That's a big finned cylinder from an atc bored to 66mm to fit the new high compression Wiseco piston which should give it a bit more grunt. It needed the top end work anyway because a choke plate screw fell out of the cheap aftermarket carb it had on it. The screw was missing but there were a zillion indentations in the combustion chamber to tell its story. I left the stock transmission in it. Though the gap between first and second gear is wider than what the Seeley trials or the TLR had, what is a guy to do? I thought the xl125 six speed tranny would help, but the 1-2 gap is just as big in that gearbox. Maybe I should have fitted a TL125 lower end or tranny in this lower end, but I can't find anything on compatibility and didn't get one in my hands before I ran out of patience and put this one back together. Any ideas on that front would be welcome.

I painted the body panels, not a perfect match to the DC fenders, but for a rider it will be just fine. Stickers are made, including extensions for the rear tank cowling. I don't want to stick them on until last though. The motor is waiting for camchain guides. I bought some aftermarket ones, and they kept sending shorter ones, like they are made for the 125 shorter stroke motor. Not much left now! Seat pad, front wheel bearings, finish the motor, rebuild the shocks and figure out springs and damping, then put the pieces all together and make them get along.

Hi Gord, I have thought about this, so I've been collecting flywheels to compare. I made a race bike out of one of these motors a while back and just removed the added on flywheel weight to gain more throttle response. This one though I expect will benefit from more weight. The XL's stock weight disc seems to be about the same as the atc200x flywheel that I have. I was hoping the atc's would be heavier. Since the stock weight comes off so easily, it might also be easy to have one made thicker the riveting it to the flywheel in place of the stock one. I'm going to ride it before doing anything like that though.

Thanks Gordh, My riding buddy Ken Faro taunted me some time ago when I couldn't find proper side panels for an xl125 motocrosser I was building. "You can make those" he said, so somehow I did. First make them in paper. Then cut out a thick plywood piece that same shape. Then cut the 1-2mm thick aluminum sheet a little bigger. Clamp the al to the wood and hammer the edges around the plywood to roll the edges over, cut seams to allow them to fold nicely, and weld the gaps. Rolling the edges around the odd shapes that weren't wood-blockable was easier than I though it was going to be. I clamped a car tire iron tightly in the vise and using the tongue shaped tip as an anvil, I whacked the edges in shape with a dead blow hammer and it was surpringly cooperative. Tig welding aluminum is something I've wanted to try for years and it is just like golf for me. Just enough goes right to keep me trying but it is otherwise 90% frustration and expensive. Time and pressure Andy, time and pressure. - Red, from Shawshank.

I've been playing with aluminum fabrication some more. My welding skills are awful, but my grinding and filling skills are really coming along..... I wanted the side panels to be stock shape, but narrower. These will get painted the standard stock flash red maybe even with the proper oem style decals. I wanted a flat trials seat base for a foam pad, but it left the rear tank mount exposed which looked awful. I built this little shell to cover that part of the tank to extend the tank line back I

I am learning how to weld aluminum, so I built this airbox for the xl trials conversion. I know it is a terrible waste of resources, but I just didn't want to run an exposed sock filter. Though a sock filter fits nicely protected inside here now. I still need to give it a drain.... Next step, making a trials seat pan with an integral cover for the exposed rear tank mount, and a set of side panels designed to sit flush with the frame rails, but to otherwise look just like the stockers. First step, make them in card stock. More aluminum welding practice to come!

Hey Gordh, I love it! How'd the gearing work out? What sprocket sizes do you have on there, and is first gear just the right speed? Neat little trials sized tank too. What's that thing off of? My original tank looks HUGE! Updates are coming soon. Thanks for sharing, Jon

This project is a great break from reality. The rear frame rails needed cut to allow the trials rear fender to fit in there. The new fender mounts were cut from the removed fender loop, and the 1979 pennies soldered in nicely to cover the holes. Now what would be super cool is to have the dual exhaust from a crf250r mounted up to each of those bulky eyelets a few inches forward. Probably not going to do that, but sure am thinking about it. Does anybody know a good replacement gearbox or just first gear for this thing? The 185 cases are supposed to be a bit narrower internally than what the newer 6 speed bikes require. The gap is just a little wider between first and second than I'd like to see. I've been scoring atv specs and only the xl125s looks to be equipped with a narrower 6 speed transmission that importantly has a little tighter 1/2 gap. Not much though, and I don't really need 6 speeds since I doubt I'll ever get beyond third. Back to grading papers for school. Thanks, Jon

The more I look at this goofy project, the more I think I want to make it into a trials bike, but with as much xl185s originality as possible. Toward that end, I am swapping the left/right welded on footpeg mounts so rather than sticking out frontwards, they will stick out rearward. This won't be quite as far backwards as may be ideal, but it will use all the stock hardware and so look as original as it can. AHRMA changed their trials bike class rules, adding a more modern twin shock class that includes Seeley's, Honda Reflex, and other similar models. The modern classic class though still includes the Honda XL185S. So maybe this would still have a better chance at being modern classic legal the more stock it looks. Who really cares about the class frankly, it isn't like I am a competitive trials rider or anything. I think I just want it to look original 'cause that's what I want. Don't suppose I really need a reason, huh?

I've been playing with the Honda a bit recently. I figure I need to get the rear suspension figured out first, then I can set up the front end with that done. I got a set of Fox snowmobile shocks off ebay that were 14", an inch and a half shorter than stock so I could move the mounts forward on the swingarm and maybe get some snail type chain adjusters instead of the goofy eye-bolt style. With the shocks out of the way of the axle now, there is plenty of room for some smaller snail cams, like the TY175 has. That plastic chain guide needed some trimming to move the rear mount up out of the way of the shock. That mount used to be right where the shock is now. Those springs sure look stout, wonder if they'll be okay.

Spoke pictures are too boring, so here are some of the highlights of my starting point: Yes, that is a construction eye-bolt re-purposed as a chain tensioner. Brings back memories of working on farmer rigs at the motorcycle shop decades ago. The brake lever pivot made out of electrical wire and a zip tie is pretty out there. Who am I to be critical though, it was still working. The last picture highlights the entire seat cover made out of some extremely strong black tape. The duct tape seat cover I had as a kid was nowhere near this nice. Catch that three foot long spark plug lead? That same fine black tape was covering a huge crack in the hi-tension coil housing. I wonder what broke that actually put this bike out of commission? Say, does anybody have a decent set of 1976-78 Honda CR125M Elsinore triple clamps? I need some 35mm triples for the replacement forks, and those would be perfect. Enjoy! Jon

Work has finally begun! I am messing with the wheels first. I still haven't found a set of 1979 xr185 wheels that would bolt right on, so I am working on another path to getting affordable alloy wheels. A pair from a 1983 xr200r presented themselves, so I snapped them up. These wheels have similar hub configuration so the drilling angles should be spot on. The aluminum rimmed XR200R wheels had larger gauge spokes than the xl185s, so the nipple body diameter is 0.015" different. When I set the smaller nipples into the aluminum rim, that tiny bit of extra spacing is less than comforting in such a critical part of the bike. How important is the clearance between the spoke nipple body diameter and the hole in the rim? Here are the details: 0.245" spoke nipple body diameter 0.275" rim spoke hole diameter 0.355" Spoke nipple head outer diameter Are these going to be okay for vintage trials use? Any thoughts are welcome. No guarantees are expected. Thank you in advance, Jon

Zisko, your bike is very cool. I can't even tell your tank apart from the Seeley. Very well done! The Dodge is up and running, the TY175 is almost together, so I am almost ready to start building this long dreamed of Honda trials. I should have a mess of stuff spread all over the place by the new year. Thanks everybody!

Great input folks! I hadn't checked in for some time and was happy to see the action. I have almost bought several TL125's, but I always decide not to because they just aren't stirring it for me. The reading on the steering angles has been helpful. Cutting the steering head and rewelding at 27 degrees sounds about right to me. Seeing how the pegs can be rear set is promisingsing too, got my eye on some of those universal weld on pegs on ebay. I got some 35mm forks with fender mounts from an old dual sport model, and aluminum triples from an xr. Ok really, I have about three donor bikes squirreled away under the deck. I'd better stop doing that. The bultaco style from fender and mudder sound good too. I hope to find a tlr200 tank from 1979/80 that would be an easy fit and look more right than anything this side of custom bent trash cans- which by way is unimaginably cool. Dang that conversion from your younger years is awesome. Work won't begin for a while yet, there is a 41 dodge convertible that keeps commanding my attention and a smashed volvo that I think I can rebuild myself too. Then a light resto on a ty175, then the bike I really want to build - this xl. I'll post progress when I actually do something...

Yeah, what could go wrong? What I really want is a 1979 Seeley Honda 'cause they stir my soul better than any other trials bike out there. Seeking to do an AHRMA trials in a couple of years, I notice that the modern classic rule book allows the 79 xl185s to be used for ahrma trials. So I found a core bike and am researching what needs done to make a respectable trials bike that stays within the rules. I don't see much evidence of others taking on this nonsensical project, but if anybody knows about it being done well, I'd love a steer toward learning more. Here are the results of my early research: Don't know rake angle, but targeting 27.5 degrees after I get my travel figured out. Plan to cut and weld top tube ala Gary Jones cr250m approach. Rear setting the foot pegs looks easy enough to get close. I see lots of variance in positioning on various bikes. Wonder what the driver is toward proper placement. I think modeling the TLR positioning is probably safe. 35mm forks from nx125 or 79 xl500s look like good starts to get trials fender mounting built in. Bigger top out spring to bring travel down to 7". No need to cut/weld damper rod to shorten I guess. I'd love a Seeley sub fuel tank and tank cover. I saw where I can buy a tank cover, but not the under tank. I think sticking with the stock xl185 tank may be the starting point though it will look funky. Looking for other options, like maybe a nice narrow cr125m tank. Universal trials fenders are somewhat elusive so far. Wondering if a ty175 rear fender will work well. Seats are pretty flat and small, making one from scratch to fit well should be okay. Wonder what rear travel it should have. No specs for any trials bike travel so far. Need to look harder maybe? 200cc cylinder from an atc will bring larger finning and more displacement. Atc200e camshaft a good choice? Is a Megacycle roller bearning torque cam a ton better? Should the headpipe stay the same small stock xl185s size? Will a bigger head pipe cause low end to suffer? Carb size? The Chinese ebay Mikuni carbs have a pretty small throat even on their "30mm" carbs. Are they a good choice? Gears from an xr have closer 1-2 gear ratios so I have a donor motor for that. Anyway, every single one of those thoughts is subject to change and I am very interested in getting more knowledgeable input on working through this project. Thanks for any input you can offer!