125 National Championship

[nsaqam]

That's why I hate when you post sideup, you always see right through my deceptions!

We are not one and the same but I do cash some hefty checks from Hollywood.

Seriously though, I don't know Lane from Adams off ox. (nice Bill Clinton reference there)

Quite honestly when I first started reading things on this site I thought "Who is this loud mouth Mich Lin?"

But the more I learned and the more I read I began to realize that Mich Lin was espousing views that were similar to my own.

I also felt sorry for him for all the abuse you guys heap on him! I may be outspoken and sometimes rash but I'd hate it if you guys piled on me the way you do on him.

ishy, I'm glad you'll be attending the next NATC meeting, are they only held once a year? I'll have to ply my local NATC Diplomat with liquor and gifts to ensure that at least one of you Diplomats is on the right side!

Would liquor and gifts work on you too?

BTW, the proposal is surely not my proposal, I've had nothing to do with it up to now but if Lane thinks that I can add any sort of value to his proposal then I've offered to help, we'll see.

[nsaqam]

The ACU Trials & Enduro Committee publicized changes to the A & B Classes in August 2002. This is due to current legislation for attaining a driving licence in the EU and the fact that the FIM are to restrict riders under 18 years of age to a 125cc Class in World Championship Trials. The changes are being phased in until January 2007 as follows:

No Alan, I still read that as 2 separate reasons. DL legislation AND FIM rules.

The UK is part of the EU, they just have not adopted the Euro as their currency as I understand it. Set me straight all you UK residents.

[brian r]

This has been a funny thread.

Ken, we know your not Lane, you can spell.

(Sorry Lane, I'm the guy that gave you the little

plastic sign with the word competitor on it and asked

you to stick it to your computor monitor for future

referance, I wouldn't have done that if I didn't think

you could take a joke).

Every one seems to agree that 125's are good for teaching the

youngsters. The question is about another class for the NATC.

Personally I'm all for it, add all the classes you want!

I make awards!

One thing that hasn't been brought up is do you take your

kid out of school to compete all around North America?

What kind of money, discipline and neglect for other family

members would be expected to pull this off?

I've seen (on TV) the Parents that give up everything for one

of their kids to make it in Dollywood. Just thinking outloud.

Edited April 20, 2006 by Brian R

[atomant]

Brian R , Please dont mention hollywood

[nsaqam]

Brian, you're right about the commitment necessary to win a 125 National Championship. You'd almost need to home school your kids like the up and coming MXers do. Both for the travel and for the training time required.

I noticed though on the NATC website that the HS class had the most competitors of any class, add to this the other youth riders competing in the Sportsman class and you may have enough to have a type of regional series where travel wouldn't be so daunting. I like the idea of local, regional and national series'

Small fields have not prevented the NATC from having classes before. The lessened travel may well get even more parents to consider a run for the title for their kids. Even relatively prosperous 125 SX (SX Lites now) has a split series to make it more affordable and accessible.

[alan bechard]

http://www.fim.ch/en/default.asp?item=28#

Cannot figure out how to grab the actual rules, but if you go there, then to the left side of the screen, then go to rules, then trials, then go there it will open a PDF and it will tell you why they limit to 125's

As to why the SX is broke up, again,, we see things differently, my take on that was that they had so many riders they had to break it in half to give everyone a chance to compete. The numbers are overwhelming.

You ever ride HS?

When I go to a MSHS, I am way back in the old fat slow incompetent guy class, and somehow believe it or not, there are folks behind me,,, anyway, there are more people on my starting lane then there are at a regional trials event. And MX is more popular then that.

Personally, I believe it was Tom Golden that nailed it on popularity on this thread.

[nsaqam]

After reading 54 pages of rules plus appendices I still don't see the reason for FIM adopting the 125cc class. Be that as it may, the fact is that FIM has a 125cc limit, the NATC mission statement says to compete at the world level AMA/NATC needs to comply with FIM rules. The NATC does not do that at present.

As to the reason for the split series in SX, it doesn't matter why they did it. The result in SX, as it would be in trials, is that travel distances and costs are reduced. Simply a matter of geography.

As I stated previously, small fields don't seem to bother the NATC. Their premier class, the "Pros" had a field of 8 pre-entries and 5 who competed in the entire series. That is in their most prestigious class.

We'll just have to differ on the potential popularity of this sport though.

[dman]

Only thing I can say about HS class is that its a step up from last year. ES lines are much more challenging and makes the event fun, not one of those 0-1-2-3 point events.

However, someone ought to think about when they are having these events. You don't know the crap some of us still in school have to go through with tests, work, catching up, upcoming college, SATS, PSATS, etc... Its very hard to find excuses to leave school for 3 days, and come back to lots of work and possible disciplinary action due to strict schools. It makes nationals nearly impossible to get to. I know enviromentally, arizona and oklahoma would've been hell in summer, but I guess you can make the arguement that the NATC is not appealing to its largest class, lol. Gladly, rhode island will be during summer vacation, but I'm kinda wonderin what's going to happen when we leave for the world round, since we're drivin to that one for friday...

So I suppose it might be hard to change how they schedule events, because its a free for all as I hear it.

So who wants a national?

We do!

When?

April.

okay, good. Who's next?

[alan bechard]

Darn, computer browsers or whatever it looks different here.

Section 052 where it is talking about the 125 and womens championship, page 33 and 34. I apologize, but I am not computer literate enough to figure out how to grab that PDF and point to it directly. Here is the short version.

The reason that they have the 125 class is to fit in with the drivers licensing requirements.

All this about the progression level etc. while I agree with in principal, is not why this exists. It is because of the way the Europeans do their drivers licensing and run their events.

It is all moot, you seem set on a 125 National class. Personally I believe it to be a can of worms. I like the freedom of run what you brung that exists in trials. (of course I like to bring something different sometimes) But hey, if that is YOUR goal, to see that 125 class adopted and put forth into fruition, more power to you. My kid may benefit from it. However I would suggest to you that you may find yourself disheartened after the NATC meeting if this is your goal. Then again, maybe not, and if you want to make it work, I would suggest linking up with Ron C as he also stated that he would like to see a 125 class occur and he is a sitting member at that table.

Good luck.

Looks like in OK those classes will be limited to 80's by the way if the weenies have thier way.

[nsaqam]

My goal is to have Americans competing for and winning WTC crowns. To that end, the adoption of a 125 class for our youngsters seems to be a logical step as it would put our kids on a level playing field with the dominant Europeans. Our kids would be learning on, and competing with the very same bikes they'd take to Europe in their quest for the World Youth title. Our kids would stay on the 125s throughout their youth careers and would master the intricacies of the small bore machines without the temptation to switch to larger bikes in an attempt to keep up with their peers. They wouldn't succumb to the allures of big displacement and effortless power.

Once again, my goal is to have our kids winning WTC crowns. Nothing more, nothing less. The run what you brung model hasn't produced the results on the world stage. Even so, the entire Sportsman class is open to riders of any age and the bikes can be of any displacement so the run what you brung model would still exist here for those who choose not to compete for the 125 National title.

But a prestigious 125 National title and the possibility of beating the best youth that Europe can offer may keep these youngsters riding 125s long after they may have moved to a big bore under the current system. This surely wouldn't hurt our chances of putting an American on the top of the worldwide podium.

As for the chances of this getting adopted, I have no idea, but either way I won't lose any sleep over it.

Edited April 21, 2006 by nsaqam

[nsaqam]

052.7.1.1 Age of riders

Trial World Championship: 18 years old and holders of a valid driver

[atomant]

The reason why in Europe the authorities force youth riders to ride 125,s is based on safety. It used to be that you could ride up to a 250cc machine on a learner plate but they changed it because of the level of fatalities.

In relation to the 125,s , I've had a go on Ross's 125 gasser and after his dads fettled with it with the Keihin and some other tweaks, it aint no slouch, especially when you have someone as light as Ross on it!

To get good results from it, Ross has developed a silky smooth clutch/throttle control which is a big factor I think.

Also, the CoC's know there are some limitations and will mark out sections which are pretty hard for them but not insane therefore, not overly exposing them to undue risks. unlike the adults where their sections are mad in my opinion!

[alan bechard]

As you said NS it is pointless, most, but so is most of this discussion because the real point is WHO is going to do anything about getting YOUR stated goal accomplished?

The point is that to hold a FIM licence you must have a drivers license. Some countries in the EU (actually I believe many, but I certainly know of 1) and I bet the UK guys will be more familiar then I, only allow you to have a "limited" licence under the age of 18. That in turn tends to drive the size requirements on the bikes.

But either way the 125 World Championship is out there to grab, and someone needs to go chase it.

You think that a 125 national class or classes will help to make that happen, I think that a motivated youngster is what will make that happen and I would be suprised if that class motivates a youngster to want to get onto the world stage but hey, as I have said several times in the past, go make it happen, my kid may benefit from it.

Here I go, I will throw out the gauntlet. All the players that can make what you are talking about happen will be at the WR coming up May 20 and 21.

You agree to come down and work and I think there is an open bunk in the cabin for a worker, and I will get you a workers pass. We hang out at a section together and debate that till the ends of the earth and I will introduce you to everyone I know about that, and we will find the folks I don't know and introduce ourselves together. I am sure we will have food and uh,,,, drink covered YOU HEAR THAT MARK, that cactus juice best be tasty! and we can maybe do something positive about getting something going instead of blathering on about it on the bulletin board.

So did you ever figure out who your NATC rep is and talk to them about this proposal?

[nsaqam]

Alan, nice to talk to you again after the forced hiatus.

My nearest and most accessible voting member of NATC is Steve Ahlers and I plan to jawbone with him at length about this issue.

I appreciate your generous offer for accomodations at the WR upcoming but due to the new job and no vacation thing I don't think I'll be able to take you up on it this year. I'll try telling the boss that I have a death or a wedding in the family but I have my doubts. I will let you know for sure shortly though. I'm dying to see another WR and would like the opportunity to meet you and other movers and shakers in this sport. Either way have a load of fun and enjoy all those astoundingly talented Europeans (and 2 or 3 Japanese) riders. I'll be getting the Trialstv dvd when it come out.

[neonsurge]

Just a thought - look at the results from this weekend's ACU Youth A & B champs round: http://www.trialscentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=8555 Compare the scores of the 125 and 250 "A" classes (both ride the same line).

Now there are obviously numerous potentially mitigating factors but there were some really big steps and climbs in that trial and the 125 riders don't seem to have had a machine disadvantage!