gasserman Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 chris well done this year and winning the novogar if it is you. ive done 4 rounds now and struggled with all of them and im not to bad a rider. Chris out of intrest why dont you do the top championship which colley and dabs do is it because is it way to hard,if it is then this is how lots of people think about the novogar trials.can you see what imean lots of riders would like to do them but just way to hard. I think the novagar shoud be for riders who dont do the british expert class or solo if they can do both then its always going to be to hard for most of us. i thought the novogar was for clubmen not riders who do the british champs as well its like another championship for the top lads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 The organising clubs enjoy the prestiege of having top riders enter on a no points basis, it raises the profile of the event and (speaking for the Colmore) they help to make the trial more comercialy viable. If riders who have scored points in the British or WT championships were actually prohibited from riding, it would make setting out these events easier. But we would miss those riders. It's a catch 22 situation. Only a thought but if this is the solution, then perhaps previous clubman champions should also be prohibited? This would give the others a chance and get the series back to being clubman friendly. Just look at the winners of the Colmore over the past 25 years. How many of these were clubmen when they won? M.Rathmell, J.Reynolds, Y.Vesterinen, S.Saunders, E.Lejeune, T.Scarlet, S.Colley, W.Braybrook, D.Lampkin, R.Crawford, G.Jarvis, S.Connor and D.Thorpe. I say again..... we'd miss riders such as this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Simple then if you would not want the top riders to miss your event don't make it a novogar. Chris, you can ride in all the national (and win) so to want the novogars set out to a standard that suits you, as does the expert championship is a bit much. I havn't seen you doing the euro rounds either you could do those well, so there is another championship you could do. The novogars (10? rounds) should be set out easier for sure 23 for the winner means what 88 for the tenth man? thats alot (majority?) over a 100, bit like you doing a world round? I am not trying to have apersonal attack on you (Chris pearson) just using you or someone of your youth and ability as an example. As for the classic over 40 that is a joke really, the trials are generally poor and marked out for twinshocks, my guess is the top riders would all switch to novogars if they were eased. OK birkett wouldn't ride many but if they were decent standard I'm sure many more would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 (edited) Pete, didn Edited November 21, 2006 by Betarev3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Yes, Lejeune won in 1987. Other winners include: W.D.South was the first winner in 1911 Vic Brittain won in 1939 Sammy Miller in 59, 60, 61, 65 & 67 Mick Andrews in 72 M.Rathmell in 75, 78 & 79 D.Lampkin in 94 & 95 And not forgetting Steve Saunders in 83, 84, 85, 86, 88, 90, 93, 98, 99 & 2000. Concerning the severity of next years Novogar Colmore, it is very likely that this will be an easier event than for some years. It will be set out to appeal to riders like Betarev3 who are genuine clubman. The top lads (and that includes past champions!) will find it easy going, so they'll just have to concentrate on not loosing that silly 'I'll never get that back' five. Won't they! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 (edited) Pete, hat off to you mate, cant be an easy decision to make and carry out for such a prestigious trial as The Colmore, really hope it goes well for the club, sure it will and the entries swell. I would still expect it to be the hardest trial I have ever done but not impossible, I would be happy dropping 100plus as long as the sections are not totally above anything I am capable of doing or capable of wanting to have a go at. Thinking back to the great club trial you put on at Saintbury, the section that actually took the marks of Jack and Sam was not the one everyone thought it would be. The big Geoff Capes climb with the big root which had most of the rider Edited November 21, 2006 by Betarev3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Thanks Justin, I'll pm you about something else later. For the Colmore the final decision rests with Alan Wright, he is the Clerk of the Course and loves hard trials. He is also quite a good rider himself, although the old codger is retired now! The Colmore is never going to be an easy ride, especially if it rains or freezes as it did last year but I will try my hardest to make it as clubman friendly as possible next year. Most of the section plotters will be happy with this, although the decider will almost certainly be set out by Mr Hicken. Remember the three sisters from 2002 in Dovedale and Jarvis' seized (not seized ) bike! Now they were tough sections... even by WTC standards. I don't think we will see those in 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikespace Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 You can still have some pretty serious sections. As someone said above, there have been too many sections at some of the trials where even centre experts feel they need to ask for a 5. Most people don't mind a good hard secction scattered in the mix, but most clubman object to step after step which are 5h1t or bust - throw the bike away and try not to break any bones, 10 foot undercut splats with no run up etc etc. We would not plan to have our trial any easier than this year. We actually aimed slightly harder than some of the sections turned out, but it's about what we were after looking through the majority of the marks lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the addict Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Bikespace, I have heard your trial was just about spot on this year, wish it had nt clashed with the Hipwell or we would have come and made the numbers up , hopefully see you next year, its definately in Ralphs little black book as a definate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timp Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 (edited) Bikespace I agree with Betarev3, clashing with the Hipwell will cost you a lot of entries. I know its probably too late for next year but its worth trying to avoid it for future years. As for the colmore I see it as a great pity to lose the top riders from competing because its too easy. Surely better to run as a national on its own merit with 2 routes (clubman and hard) than be part of the novogar series. What do you gain by being a part of it? Edited November 21, 2006 by Timp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted November 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Looking purely at entry numers for the Colmore, numbers are always up when it is a Novogar round. Last year the club struggled to cover costs with such a low entry. We don't run trials to make money but we certainly need to make something. The most important thing is to give the maximum number of customers what they want so that they enjoy the trial and come back year after year. By considering two routes, (thats considering only) we were only trying to react to our customers needs. As we are unable to run two routes, we will adapt the event to broaden its appeal in other ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris Posted November 22, 2006 Report Share Posted November 22, 2006 Chris out of intrest why dont you do the top championship which colley and dabs do is it because is it way to hard To be honest I wanted too a couple of years ago but you need a full time minder and a good one a that, my dad does a good job but he can't always get to all the sections as he has to walk (he can't ride at all!). I havn't seen you doing the euro rounds either you could do those well, so there is another championship you could do. I done a few but none this year, same again really need a minder to do them properly. I did a few on the international class last year as they are easier so I could do them on my own but didn't fancy doing them this year as there wasn't much competition. The novogars (10? rounds) should be set out easier for sure 23 for the winner means what 88 for the tenth man? thats alot (majority?) over a 100, bit like you doing a world round? Actually the tenth man was on 45 and there were only 7 men and 1 woman over a 100, the average score was 70 marks. This is perhaps the main problem with the low entries, people having misconceptions about how hard they are. Chris, you can ride in all the national (and win) so to want the novogars set out to a standard that suits you, as does the expert championship is a bit much. Perhaps it is a bit much but I really like the novogar series, a lot more than the expert championship anyway, (sarcasm on) why don't you try any get a proper over 40's class in that and leave the novogar alone To me though if you did have two routes in the novogars you could have a national championship on the hard route and a good over 40's & clubman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralph Posted November 22, 2006 Report Share Posted November 22, 2006 Well said that man (Chris) i to would like to see 2 routes 160 + riders the top riders on our doorstep, bring it on. I for one would love to do a road base trial every other week and to be riding around with the likes of the names mentioned earlyer couldn't think of a better day out. A JOY to see them uns ride while walking a section. Nice. I can't see a problem with two routes, 30 on the hard rest on the easyer one or any amounts. Northern Experts was a great trial. I can't see why the same can't apply for the Colmore, with the the Novergar run on the easyer course. If there is any chance to be walking in the same section as say Mr Saunders to the left, Dad to my right and the observer souting mind ya back Tubby Young Morris is riding the section, The boy wonder is lining up with Mr Jarvis and Mr Colley thats blo#dy hevan that is, Young Sam doing a few wheel hops just to get me to say Nice Very Nice, i say again Bring it on 2 Routes at the Colmore. Oh and in the same section as Chris (is he any good ) If anyone says they wont come i say yes they will Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 22, 2006 Report Share Posted November 22, 2006 See where you are coming from, but the novogars are one route trials for a reason, perhaps John COLLINS can explain the reason for this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted November 22, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2006 (edited) Certainly for 2007 the Novogar Trials are one route. I leave you all to your opinions - as they all seem valid and sensible - and again 2008 can be looked at - and ( sorry) again it was on the table for the cancelled forum. My opinion is very much same as Bikespaces - I feel that we have to accept that he Novogar - was the original MCN Clubmans Championship. It is not designed for the better Expert riders - and we fear that the two route system will inevitable lead to a harder Expert course - and yes whilst possible a better Clubmans course - this will eventually be forgotten or become an add on - and just a make up numbers course. What we are after - is a genuine series - not aimed at the good Experts but at the good and middle level Clubman. If the Clerk of the course is aiming just to take marks off the top runners - Championshiop and Expert - we the T & E have made a mistake by giving that club a round. It is absolutely pointless deciding on a series - and then letting each individual Organiser put their own interpretation on it - this is not the way to go . We stated all this clearly last year - and I think things started to turn in the right direction. The Colmore I am sure will take this into account when organising Novogar this year - they surely could not be expected to last year when it was a normal National. This is actually another point - there are lots of good Nationals - and they have the choice of one or two routes etc - they can and do run excellent events to cater for their participants. The Novogar is a series - and the concept is laid down. The real answer for the Clubmen who wish to enjoy this Championship is to support the rounds that are clearly supporting you - rather than bowing to the pressure of a few individuals you are just looking for another " win". The format for the 2007 series has been agreed, The Stratford club are proud to be associated wih the Novogar championship and look forward to running the Colmore in March. We will make sure the severity is correct as John pointed out in his reply earlier in the thread. Edited November 22, 2006 by scorpa3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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