motovintage Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 when off road race bikes starting going 4 stroke a 250 2 stroke was allowed to compete with 450 4 strokes and they were considered equals, like wise a 125 2 stroke competes with 250 4 strokes, why are trials 4 strokes 250's, when we've been riding 250 & 300 2 T's, then we are expected to step down to 250 4T's. isn't that abought the same as steping down to a 125 2T? Sure Tony bou's bikes are way trick with over bore and super light. Montesa can't even sell them here in the US, there are too many good 2T's still being produced, I guess I'm just mad that my favorite brand, Montesa no longer produces a bike I want to buy, and now wont even import their bikes to the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for artie Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 No need for 450's in trials mate. Trials bikes need only produce about 18 to 20 hp and that is easily done with 250 to 300cc four stroke. The MX bikes need to produce 40 to 50 HP hence the need for bigger motors. You are applying MX logic to Trials design. All the trials bikes are very close in power production. What is needed in trials is torque and a broad power deliver not max HP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motovintage Posted September 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) No need for 450's in trials mate. Trials bikes need only produce about 18 to 20 hp and that is easily done with 250 to 300cc four stroke. The MX bikes need to produce 40 to 50 HP hence the need for bigger motors.You are applying MX logic to Trials design. All the trials bikes are very close in power production. What is needed in trials is torque and a broad power deliver not max HP. to me the Montesa 250 4T seems so under powered compared to my Montesa 250 2T ? if not a 450 then maybe a 350 or 400 might do it for me... less power and a heavier bike just doesn't make sence to me Edited September 23, 2008 by MotoVintage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outlaw dave Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Get a ride on a Sherco 320 4T - They have lots of power. and are the best price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motovintage Posted September 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I think I'm staying with the 2T for now, but I will be going back to Beta http://www.trialscentral.com/cms/showartic...?articleID=4176 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeble Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Jesus mate you must be one hell of a rider if a 4rt hasn't got enough power for you.I know plenty of expert riders who ride 'em and i've yet to hear one of them say they've not had enough power to clear obstacles that most mere mortals (my self included) would even attempt!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motovintage Posted September 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) Jesus mate you must be one hell of a rider if a 4rt hasn't got enough power for you.I know plenty of expert riders who ride 'em and i've yet to hear one of them say they've not had enough power to clear obstacles that most mere mortals (my self included) would even attempt!!!!! no I'm a crippled up old dude, maybe it's just me but I felt the Montesa 250 4T is underpowered compared to my 315R Edited September 23, 2008 by MotoVintage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikespace Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 no I'm a crippled up old dude, maybe it's just me but I felt the Montesa 250 4T is underpowered compared to my 315R I think they can give that feel when you first get on them. The 4 stroke sort of feels like it's holding you back all the time. I found this a little with the Sherco 4 stroke too, and I had a nightmare in mud, because there seemed to be a lack of feeling. I'm still a 2 stroke bod, but I found the 4RT to be much better when I knocked it up a couple of gears. It felt less restrictive, and copes much better in the mud. There's plenty of torque there to handle the higher gears. I'm not arguing with you, it's personal perception, but worth trying again if it's only the power that's stopping you. Knock it up a gear or two and wind it on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daggs888 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 no I'm a crippled up old dude, maybe it's just me but I felt the Montesa 250 4T is underpowered compared to my 315R I think this is all about the characteristics of the power output .... also rev the 4rt hard and it just doesnt sound like it's working as hard as a 2t on full tilt .... but snap the clutch out on the 4rt and you'll be assured it's gona pull as good as most of the 2t's ..... it's gona pull like a chuffing train ... and there's few around that can handle that much yaaahoooo. Mont 315 is a good bike .... but give the 4rt a chance and you'll see why it cost several of million of pounds to develop and perfect the engine (which in my opinion will still be basicaly the same for the next few years at least) viva 4rt P.S. 450 is to heavy, over powered and not relevant to trials .... having said that I do love a run out on the o'l 450 exc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 no I'm a crippled up old dude, maybe it's just me but I felt the Montesa 250 4T is underpowered compared to my 315R Picture this, you've a real snotty hill climb and on your 315 its a 4th gear assault flat-out. The question would here, would a 4rt push 5th gear knowing you'd always run a higher gear on the 4rt?. Second point, blip the throttle on a 4rt and do the same blip on a 315 and see which bikes lifts the front wheel easier. Thirdly, if my memorial serves me right wasn't the likes of Steve Saunders in the 80's riding a 360cc Honda compared to the more popular Yamaha TY250? The 4rt is the nuts on rocky streams and is more stable and confident inspiring than a 315. I also like the quality of the 4rt and i think this is an over looked topic.....o yeah i've owned both 315 and a 4rt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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