big john Posted February 13, 2008 Report Share Posted February 13, 2008 BJ I saw your comment on youtube, and I agree, nothing wrong with the bike when it's hot and has vomited out all the excess oil, then it runs brilliantlyAnd you have three very nice looking bikes there, the RTL looks like a minter. I think Conny bought my bike from John Shirt but not exactly sure, is it the same with yours? The late model disc braked RTL I bought from Conny may have originated in the USA, maybe one from the Spen Bly stable, but I'm not 100% certain of that. Conny bought it in Sweden. It certainly wasn't a UK supplied bike when new. I checked it out when I bought it and I registered the bike here in Scotland. Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted February 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 The late model disc braked RTL I bought from Conny may have originated in the USA, maybe one from the Spen Bly stable, but I'm not 100% certain of that. Conny bought it in Sweden. It certainly wasn't a UK supplied bike when new. I checked it out when I bought it and I registered the bike here in Scotland.Big John If Conny bought it in Sweden and it originated from the USA, then I would put my money on that it was Jonny Andersson who bought it in the USA and rode it in the American trials championship. Does it have a steeper steering head angle than original? Because I know Jonny changed that on some of his Hondas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted February 14, 2008 Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 To be honest I haven't checked the head angle! Once I find my tape measure, I'll let you know! It could be an Ex-Jonny Andersson bike, but unless I could check out the engine and frame number with him, I can't be 100% sure. As far as I'm concerned I would not be too bothered if it was not an Andersson bike, I always fancied a disc braked RTL, in fact I bought a complete rolling chassis less motor, just for "spares". However I still have a mind to put an RTL motor in it as it would be a shame to break the rolling bike up, wouldn't it? Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 For those of you who are interested. This is me and my dad riding my Honda after we put it back together the last time. Damn that thing sounds like a purring tiger. (the four legged kind, not the triumph) I want one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fracy Posted February 23, 2008 Report Share Posted February 23, 2008 Hi there Ludde: I was a good friend of Jonny when we both lived in Tn, USA. I have tryed with you before to contact him. I have recently had mail from his sister, but still unable to get an email address for Jonny. Can you help yet! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted April 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 An update on the Honda. Well, the engine is in pieces again. This time I'm replacing everything I can think of, valve guides, piston rings, o-rings, head gasket. Actually, the head gasket together with the valve guide reamer were the parts that took the longest time to get hold of. This time, to avoid missfit between the head and valve guides, we will heat up the head enough to fit the valve guides without having to knock them into place with high force. I just hope that the o-rings don't get damaged when installing the valve guides. The piston rings were little hard to get a hold of. The original part number 131A0-KR9-003 is discontinued but I found another number 131A1-KR9-003 which fits nice but look abit different from the ones that were on before. Anyone know if why there is a different number on the piston rings? I hope this works because I don't know what else to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted April 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 Sometimes the Honda motors suffer oiling problems to the top end, due to oil restrictor in the cam shaft oil feed being left out, which floods the area of the valves with oil, and can lead to oil finding its way past the seals down into the motor. Not sure if the RTL motor has this restrictor fitted, but the TLRs do, and leaving it out can cause quite serious problems. Oil restrictor??? Can you give me more detailes where this restrictor should be. There is alot of oil around the area of the valves but I thought it should be like that to enhance cooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted April 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Just found an old RTL owners manual that came with a bike I had many years ago, and it doesnt show the TLR type oil restrictor, but might be worth asking a specialist if these were ever fitted to the RTL? Ok, I'll see if I can find any info on that restrictor. Another problem showed up yesterday. The new piston rings, the ones with a different number than the originals, has a larger piston ring end gap than there should be. According to the manual the gap should be 0.3-0.4 mm when new, but the new ones are 0.5 mm same as the service limit. Could I damage something with a larger end gap??? As far as I know there are no oversize pistons available so the cylinder can't be bored out, so why are these piston rings different??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest majestyman340 Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 If your ring gaps are over the service limit then the cylinder might be worn. Before going any further with this, it would be a very good idea to get the cylinder checked with a proper bore gauge. If your cylinder is out of round or has excessive taper, then it will mean rings may well not seal properly, and may well cause problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted April 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 If your ring gaps are over the service limit then the cylinder might be worn. Before going any further with this, it would be a very good idea to get the cylinder checked with a proper bore gauge. If your cylinder is out of round or has excessive taper, then it will mean rings may well not seal properly, and may well cause problems. Ok, I'll probably have to do that. The strange thing is that the old rings that were on before has the correct gap, about 0.4 mm. So I'm leaning towards using the old rings again but it feels wrong to put old parts in when I have new ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest majestyman340 Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 The ring end gap is important, but having a little wider clearance on a 3 ring type piston is not going to make that much difference though. More important is to carefully check cylinder wear, which can be assessed roughly by measuring ring gap at 4 different places in the cylinder (from top to bottom), and seeing if there is much difference between the readings. TLR/RTL 250 cylinders cannot be rebored, so if there is any noticeable signs of wear, then relining is the only real answer, and ideally a new piston fitted at the same time. Another thing to check on a Honda that smokes, is whether or not the compression rings have been fitted correctly (N markings upwards), and whether oil control ring gaps are properly spaced. New Omega pistons can be obtained from Track and Trial Motorcycles, and are far better quality than the OEM Honda parts, which are no longer available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted April 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 The ring end gap is important, but having a little wider clearance on a 3 ring type piston is not going to make that much difference though. More important is to carefully check cylinder wear, which can be assessed roughly by measuring ring gap at 4 different places in the cylinder (from top to bottom), and seeing if there is much difference between the readings. TLR/RTL 250 cylinders cannot be rebored, so if there is any noticeable signs of wear, then relining is the only real answer, and ideally a new piston fitted at the same time. Another thing to check on a Honda that smokes, is whether or not the compression rings have been fitted correctly (N markings upwards), and whether oil control ring gaps are properly spaced. New Omega pistons can be obtained from Track and Trial Motorcycles, and are far better quality than the OEM Honda parts, which are no longer available. Thanks for the info. I'll check the cylinder when I get home tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludde Posted May 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Yes, finally no smoke. Replaced almost everything in the head but the problem was probably that the second piston was installed upside down. It was very hard to start, so compression was high but also alot of smoke. The old rings had no markings on them, I think it was the original ones. The new ones are now installed the right way. Much easier to start and no smoke! Job done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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