mr b Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Hello every1, this has probably happened to you all at one time or another and has me before but not to the extreme that happened on sunday. I rode a trial at a fantastic venue called Breakheart Quarry, three laps of 15 sections which i thought were brilliantly marked out and i opted to ride the new grade of riding as inter 50/50 which is 50% expert sections and 50% alternative route sections. At the end of the day i was happy with my ride, the same old thing shouldn't have lost this and shouldn't have lost that but was basically happy. I found the results on the internet tonight where on section 9 the observer showed me round the expert route which i needed to take and on each lap i rode it and cleaned it. I find on the results on the internet that the observer has marked me down for three 5's. I am 100% sure that on each lap i cleaned the section - the three 5's cost me the win, without the marks given on this section i would have won my class which would have been brilliant - as it happens i'm GUTTED! Sorry to bore you with this story but i really feel p****d off about this and needed to get it off my chest with some other people who share the same passion for trials. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikespace Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 That's one good thing to be said for punch cards. You know when you've goofed. Possibly you missed a flag or summat, or maybe you've hopped sideways and the observer is marking to the letter of the law. Maybe even stopped and the observer's not sure of the rules? At least with punch cards you know exactly what you've lost and probably why. Maybe next week eh. Not worth losing any sleep over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endo kid Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Its happened to all of us at sometime but it also goes the other way sometime just put it down to human error Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr b Posted February 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Totally agree with the punch cards point of view - but this does require more observers and usually brings on queues. The annoying thing is that the observer showed me the way to go and never corrected me. Never mind - will just have to kick ass on the next trial! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartc Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 Ask your sec to check the score cards, could be an input mistake, these things DO HAPPEN I know, I've done it !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austini Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Ummmmmmm nobody complains when it happens to some other sucker and you win by default!!! I always go back to the observer (unless its the wife) and tell them I dropped a two when they mark me down for a clean!!!!! Got to watch the Delruth 05 dvd last night and noticed a few riders got one's and two's instead of threes when they clearly dragged the bike through the section, nobody complained on that one although Dougie complained when he sent some tape flying!!!!. S@#t happens, when the observer is standing out in the pouring rain for six hours freezing thier tackle off and not getting paid for it. In a field of say 60 riders riding 8laps at a club trial an observer watches a grand total of 480 individual rides some margin for error both + & - has to be expected. Any observer whether a eight year old child or a 60 year old senile old geezer is better than self observing!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the artist formerly known as ish Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Got to watch the Delruth 05 dvd last night and noticed a few riders got one's and two's instead of threes when they clearly dragged the bike through the section, nobody complained on that one although Dougie complained when he sent some tape flying!!!!. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Interesting post Austini, I was stood right at the place it happened and saw riders prior to Doug ride the section and what happened when he did ride it, I also saw the cause/reason for his complaint. You saw the Video, what would you call the score, the observer can only call what he saw, he was correct from what he saw, full marks to him for sticking to his guns, Doug was also correct in complaining about the score given him, he excepted it and moved on, I know others would of cried blue murder and called the observer all the xxxxxxxxx under the sun, in the same situation. I'll post what I saw a little later in the post, more TC readers will have seen the video what did you see, and what was the correct score. I would say an observer who would give his favorite rider a clean after fiving a section is a dodgy observer, in this case who knows why the observer fived you, but from my experience most observers want a rider to be successful and the only reason they would give a rider a five is because they earned it. This is what waiting in line to ride a section would look like if trials was scored hard, fair, and by the book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattylad Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Rule number 1. Never complain about a score you will get the benefit of the doubt 9 time out of 10. Rule number 2. Ride for pleasure, in your heart you won so the next victory will be all the sweeter. Rule number 3. I think the above two are enough to get by with! Remember you ride for 5 hours the poor bugger observing is stood in an uncomfortable place with no facilities for your pleasure. Lifes too short to be anything other than grateful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austini Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 ok ishy ive called in the experts on this one ie:the misses!!!!! She would let it go because the tape wasn't snapped and the peg still in the ground, however the aussi bible states (10.5.3.2 a five occurs when : Breaking a boundary tape or dislodging a boundary marker) Now Dougie succeeded in seperating the tape from the marker without dislodging the marker or breaking the tape????????? how you interperate that one is a toughy!!!! Its the same as dislodging a log that a tapes connected too, seperating the tape without breaking it, five or clean????? I noticed Raga fived the same section before that and an explanation wasn't forthcomming????? in summery, excellent work by the observer he stuck to his guns on both accounts which I class as consistancy or "KARMA" what ever way you read it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 I've been on the recieving end of this one too. A few years ago, a certain World Champion dabbed in a mud slot just before a climb out of a section I was observing, miles from no-where on a moor. He came back to me and said "was that ok mate?" I replied "Yes, just the one." Then I copped it. "That was clean" he said "no way did I dab there!" The surrounding (minders) fellow competitors, gathered closer but despite more of the same, I stuck to my guns. I must admit, I did start to doubt my own eyes, but the score stood. As the annoyed gang roared off to the next section, a spectator came up to me with a video camera. "You were right" he said. Sure enough there was the dab. The trial was won on one mark, the World Champion (mention no names) was on two. Sure left me with a bad feeling. Ever after that I politely enquire as to my score. Sometimes it's plus, sometimes minus. That's the sport. Loosing three unexpected fives does sound a bit strange, for piece of mind it might be worth a very humble and appologetic call to the secretary to see if there was an adding up mistake, which does happen. I do have these kind of calls, which I don't mind, especially as the results were wrong on one occasion. It's easy to miss/jump a row when your typing in rows of numbers. Perhaps the next rider down had three cleans he wasn't expecting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr b Posted February 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 i totally agree with everyone views on this topic and observing can be a bloody miserable long day which on sunday it was cold and long, but i always make sure i am polite and friendly to all of them and am extremely grateful for the job they are doing, and when i've rode each section for the last time i make sure i say thankyou to each of them, i too have observed on many occasions and no doubt i've put a mark wrong here or there. Its just frustrating when 15 marks more are on your score card. Like i said tho, it was a fantastic trial with a fantastic venue and brilliantly marked out, i'd certainly ride there again and ride for that club again!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the artist formerly known as ish Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 What I saw!! a prior rider to Doug broke the tape, and received a five for it, correct call. The tape was repaired for the next rider, but!! it wasn't repaired and in the same condition it was in before the rider broke it. It was loose, floating on top of the water and not secured to the pin correctly, water splashing against it caused it to come out of the pin loop and float away from the pin, The observer had given prior riders 5's for dislodging the marker at this point, the marker was dislodged and Doug got a 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austini Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Given the conditions the observers at the delruth did a fantastic job, some of the calls were well managed. ie: On some of the tougher (even tougher) sections some riders slipped back half a wheel, but because of the severity of the section and the rider still carrying on to fight his way over the other ten 6ft rocks in the section they were not given a five. The pressure of giving a top 10 rider a five when the crowd and the minders are screaming and clapping him over his fantastic ride must be immence!!!! especially when for the other 363 days of the observers year the likes of Lampkin, Fuji and Raga have near demi god status!!! Ishy do you know the story behind Fuji on the second day when he was given a two, the observer then explained why and indicated to something on his shoulder, Fuji talked to the observer, they both smiled and Fuji was given a one????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atomant Posted February 17, 2006 Report Share Posted February 17, 2006 Scores dont bother me too much as to me they are arbitary and just a source of banter with the other club members & riders but I have to say without any doubt, that the percentage of scores that go in your favour far outway the scores against, especially on blind spots. At Hawkstone when there were a few observers on each section, some of the riders were getting dabs but not being seen and I didnt see any rider go up to an observer and say.." You gave me a clean Didnt you see that dab I done you idiot" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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