The mud was a big thing for me when I first got my 07 Montesa 250 as I was in western WA in the US and most of the time it was wet because of rain trees and included all kinds of wet leaves and stuff on the ground I had to ride in. I had two riding buddies at the time and both on 2T Gas Gas's and I didn't have any trouble riding with them. It was different and I started my trials on the Montesa as my first bike so that might have helped but never had any trouble with traction and keeping up with them and progressing.
Move to Idaho a number of years ago now so had to re-learn how to ride on dry sticky rocks... was quite the adjustment.
I have an 07 250 4RT and a 17 300RR Montesa and spend some good time on a 18 Beta 300 4T. For the most part they are very close however the Montesa has more pull at the low end with the Beta being softer on the low end. The Montesa has just a bit smother throttle through the full range with the top end of both being so close I couldn't tell the difference. The Montesa when swapped for a quick throttle tube (they come stock with a slow/black one) is a lot more aggressive than the Beta even my 250 is more lively with a quick throttle than the Beta however not as much pull as the 300 Beta above the half way point to the top but rev's quicker for sure.
The Montesa seemed to carry the weight a bit lower and feels more planted than the Beta did, I found the Beta to be more lively for the suspension and even though the Montesa where adjustable can be nearly the same it still feels a bit less so I think because of how it carries the weight.
On the traction side of things I find the Montesa to be much better in the wet than any of the 2T bikes I have been on (Gas Gas 125/250 2T, Beta 250/300 2T) however different and if your used to a 2T it will take some time to adjust to the difference.
Between the two I side to the Montesa for the EFI over all considering the only adjustment I have ever had to do is idle/tick-over at very high elevation.
Hope that helps a bit with at least one persons experience between a Beta and Montesa 4T.
PS, Maintenance on the Montesa is more complex with the way they do the oil filter so that might be worth note.
I would have to give the alpinestars the nod for stiff when considering ankle issues. My wife's garnier are much softer in almost every way. Good luck.
It should self prime with a couple kicks after adding fuel. After that you may need to give it full throttle and a single kick to reset the ECU for it to start but that would be about it unless as indicated by lemur the pump failed.
Thank you for everyones feedback! Sorry I was at work. So, for normal trail riding, not at all. Slow technical, using clutch to pop my tires at a standstill, yes. Now I am not sure if I will feel that way with any trials bike since the front comes up way easier than an enduro bike. Only reason I bought a 300 TXT was the cost, got it for about $1500.
I am 40 years old, and weigh about 200 lbs without gear but ride in about 6k feet elevation. definitely a super entry level trials rider ha ha
Have a quick question, a Montesa been seeing those with a seat?
Montesa's don't come with a seat by default in most places, however they can be found if you want one and are willing to look around for them. The catch is depending on your location it maybe hard to get one though.
If your leaning to E-Start then I would lean to a TRS 250 as most people really don't need 300's. Gas Gas's are known for being harder to start in general. Even my daughters 125 Gas Gas was harder for me to start when cold than my Montesa 300 RR (not harder to kick over but to get started, especially when cold).
I know its opinion and having my bias to Montesa's would get another in a snap if I was after an upgrade as I find them great on a trail and at the club events myself. They do have there disadvantages however so are not for everyone.
Not sure myself on if it can be converted but I would expect at the latest you can get a low compression head/insert. hopefully someone else knows the exact answer.
Makes sense, I admit I am quite interested in hearing what others think as well. Though if I still had a 2T bike I would be willing to give it a try. Only have a couple of Montesa 4T's at this time so not really in the cards for me.
The concept sounds good, I have to wonder how long it would last, how it would sound, if it would capture oil more, and such. If you ever end up giving it a try I would be interested in the outcome.
Yes and no part numbers are different but one is black and the other is silver. everything else looks the same to me between both my bikes so I would expect someone could interchange them without issue.
11350-NN4-000 - for my 2007 250 and a 2022 260
11350-NN4-L60 - for my 2017 300 and a 2022 301
As mentioned before, I very much doubt it will need a piston or cam chain unless oil changes have been seriously neglected, they are properly built.
The cam chain tensioner is self adjusting and shouldn’t be out of spec at that age, but well worth a look. Checking valve clearances would be an easy one too.
I only suggest the cam chain tensioner because I have heard of a few of them having issues where they would bind up and not keep the needed pressure and so get some chain slap. Where not a common issue one of the ones I know about was on a newer 260 (couple years old) so figured considering how easy it is to check that part it was worth a look.
The one I indicated here was replaced by a manual tensioner and the sound went away and the owner likes it better, however if swapped with a manual version it would need to have the tension checked from time to time.
What ever the case I hope it turns out something simple to fix it like changing fuel, the tensioner, or spark plug etc.
Before going all in on that I would double check the timing chain tensioner. I know that you can get a noise that sounds a bit like piston slap from the chain. Would be the least invasive check and if the issue would be one of the lower cost options. Well worth a look in my opinion.
Also, unless you put piles of hours on your bike or are not doing oil changes it is more likely something simple like the tensioner than a piston issue considering the year of even the oldest 301's in comparison to how long most Montesa's last in my opinion. good luck.
I know this is a very old thread however I think it really depends on what kind of speeds your going and if road or trail riding.
On a decently open trail where I was able to hold a lot of 4th gear and some 5th mid RPM and almost never going below 3rd on my Montesa I was able to get just over 23 miles on the 2 Liter tank of fuel. (Bike was a 2007 Montesa 4RT 250).
When I ride a lot of slower more technical trails or higher RPM's the fuel drops and I don't get that much. I had to carry extra fuel to be sure I could make the loop I was riding, ended up only needing 1 of the 3.5 extra I had with me.
@jonnyc21 I've never felt like the plastic safety clips would be either secure enough or comfortable. But assumptions are completely unreliable.
I've plenty of neck lanyards with them so perhaps I'll give one a try.
The other option I've used on other applications is to just butt melt the ends of the cord/webbing together. It's a little inconsistent but it does make a fairly secure weak point. Perhaps with an appropriate simple tool it would be easy to get a fairly consistent join?
Hmmm, might be today's project.
I have to agree on feeling that most would not be secure enough, part of why I was looking at ones online that I felt might be better. As for comfort, I can only hope one I try is close enough that with a thin sleeve it might be decent but even then I think that will be the part that is the most difficult.
I also had the thought of using some fishing line to connect the ends together as I could then figure out how many strands of what test was needed to match the breakaway of a current tether. would solve the comfort issue that way as well.
I remember thinking along those lines ages ago, but I guess I just got used to the light webbing lanyard (a Beta OEM lanyard) I have and forgot about it.
That's exactly why the neck name tag lanyards have that little plastic breakaway clip. I don't think I'd want to rely on one of those, but something similar.
Industrial fall arrest shock absorber devices use rows of lengthwise sewing that tear away, absorbing force as they break. That could be appropriate - Z fold the ends of the webbing over (so the stitching isn't in straight shear - that would be too strong unless you had very few stitches which would be susceptible to wear) then a couple of lines of stitching. On high load the stitching will tear down it's length before separating. Join at the back of the wrist.
I might give it a go with some old neck lanyard webbing.
I can see a cottage industry making non-stretch, breakaway trials lanyards. Thinking tiny-house cottage, perhaps tent size cottage even. 😀
Ya I have a back burner thought on picking up several breakaway buckles and testing the brake point of an old tether strap and doing the same with the buckles and comparing the results to see if I can find something that would work well enough I would be willing to use. (Comfort would be a consideration as well)
Some examples of what I was thinking about testing...
My two favorites:
PS. If anyone beats me to this I am happy to give them the credit as it isn't really something I care to try and make into a product. I will likely share the results here for everyone just not planning on making any for others.
Who'd have thunk the humble kill switch would get so much discussion. 😁
Lanyards - anything non-stretchy. Webbing off a conference lanyard works nicely. Or fancy coloured boot laces. Or paracord available in a zillion colours. Used them all and nothing to pick between them in my opinion. Elastic is junk - I don't really understand why the pros use it still. Must be a reason, they don't do anything for no reason at that level. My guess is so it's maybe easier to get their score card/transponder out at end of section - might save a time penalty one day? But if your hands off the clutch the bikes probably not running anyway in that situation. A mystery.
I have thought more about your question on why the Elastic is used than most and where I am not sure about it I am of the perception that the primary thing around the elastic that most of the other options I have seen people come up with don't have is safety in relation to it braking if critical.
Most of the replacements I have seen people make are of materials that I would never want around my wrist if that lanyard was to snag in something like the rear sprocket or the chain if still spinning, that could take a hand off. I would much rather replace the elastic more often than have it not brake if it snags on something that has the mass/potential to do me real harm if it didn't brake. (Is this likely? I doubt it, but not worth the potential risk in my mind)
I would be happy to use something more like Lineaway dose before changing out the cord from elastic to something thicker unless I was able to come up with some kind of brake-away at the top where my wrist is that I felt would save me in the event it was snagged in a drastic way.
I just switched to a Montesa 301RR. My most noticable difference is hopping in certain situations, it doesn't have the quick throttle response of my 300 2-strokes. For example, when climbing a hill and I have to hop over a feature, I could just snap the throttle and hop over it on my 2T, the montesa doesn't do that just through throttle response. So I have to keep the revs higher and modulate power throught the clutch approaching the feature, and then have some revs available at the feature to pop the clutch and hop. The throttle response of the 2T actually made me lazy where I wasn't popping the clutch to clear stuff. Now with the clutch pop, you get way more suspension rebound for a hop. It is little things like these to get used to. I like the sound and the characteristics more than the 2T now
If you haven't looked you might check if it has the black (slow) throttle tube, if so you can wake them up a lot by swapping to a white. I put a white (quick) on my 300 RR and love it over the black it came with.
Oh and I agree that I have a lot more hop and snap by keeping the revs up and using the clutch more and also feel that is good even with the white tube.
To be honest I'm quite a big 18yr old (96kg) the bike doesn't feel especially heavy, It doesn't seem to grip as well as the 2stroke as I remember. Might be due to my tyre pressure and riding technique as I'm aggressive. Seems to purr through Rock sections tho.
I may not be a young one but I am ~93kg and I find that around 0.34-0.41 bar (5-6psi) front and 0.25-0.28 bar (3.5-4psi) rear on my Montesa 300RR seems to work great for traction, softer dirt and roots I go on the low end, rocks and hard edges I ride the top end of that.
I might be reading it wrong, however according to the top pined post on parts manual information a 51M is for the Cota 348 and 349 and should be 305.8cc/349.6cc respectively. (hope I have that correct)
I started my daughter out, at around 8, on a small PW50 clone to learn to ride and as soon as she was good on that I upgraded her to a beta 80 with a clutch. It didn't take long for her to learn the clutch even after the auto on the smaller bike and so if your kid can ride a bike I would expect even a Beta 80 small wheel would be a great first bike.
Beta 4T vs Montesa 4RT (and 250 vs 300...)
in General Trials Talk
Posted · Edited by jonnyc21
The mud was a big thing for me when I first got my 07 Montesa 250 as I was in western WA in the US and most of the time it was wet because of rain trees and included all kinds of wet leaves and stuff on the ground I had to ride in. I had two riding buddies at the time and both on 2T Gas Gas's and I didn't have any trouble riding with them. It was different and I started my trials on the Montesa as my first bike so that might have helped but never had any trouble with traction and keeping up with them and progressing.
Move to Idaho a number of years ago now so had to re-learn how to ride on dry sticky rocks... was quite the adjustment.
What ever way you go, good luck making the call!