it shouldnt be up to riders to downgrade themselves as soon as they are made up

It isn't - it's up to the Trials Committee but if he doesn't want to ride with the other experts and ride the easy route, then surely that's ok?

makes a joke of the system

Any better system in mind?

Reading the story from Overthehill of the newly made Expert who was immediately allowed to downgrade, it appears that the existing SACU club award-based upgrading rules allow the creation of Experts and "experts but not really experts" which isn't a stones throw from fatbikedudes comment that the term Expert is meaningless as far as scottish trials are concerned.

There is a world of difference between the man who consistently finishes in the top handful of the Scottish Trials Championship and the rider who makes Expert status by picking up the odd Best Club Member award at sparsely attended summer Nationals. I know another rider (or maybe it's the same one?) who was upgraded to Expert last year in the latter sort of way and he was very obviously far out of his depth when he got in among the big boys.It certainly wasn't his fault that he found himself in that predicament it's just the way the present "system" works.

One simple solution towards making gradings "meaningful" would be for all upgrading to be done purely on results at Scottish Championship trials, with Novice to Non Expert upgrading going to the best novice on the B route ,and points towards attaining (or retaining) Expert status going to the top 10% or 15% of finishers on the A route. In this way the lads with ambition to prove themselves would know precisely what they were aiming at, instead of the present situation where some clubs give loads of qualifying awards while others give none at all. (Personally I think Scottish Championship Trials should revert to a single route but that's another story!.) Ordinary club level riders who rarely travel to trials outwith their own clubs area have no interest in upgrading anyway and are only looking for an enjoyable Sunday out on their bikes.

Lastly, to IDMCCSEC, why should a rider who has attained Expert status fairly and squarely under the SACU rules be allowed,by the Trials Committee, to downgrade immediately to Non-Expert and continue to compete against other Non-Experts?. This isn't the same as an Expert riding the "B" route for no award, which is perfectly acceptable.

Edited March 9, 200422 yr by trialscot

Any better system in mind?

FBDs idea of top 10 in championship seems a good starting point.

being honest you'd be lucky to have 10 riders in Scotland who deserve it!

note that our SACU steward is very quiet on this one

Lastly, to IDMCCSEC, why should a rider who has attained Expert status fairly and squarely under the SACU rules be allowed,by the Trials Committee, to downgrade immediately to Non-Expert and continue to compete against other Non-Experts?. This isn't the same as an Expert riding the "B" route for no award, which is perfectly acceptable.

I don't know the answer to that, maybe you should ask the Trials Committee.

As far as an Expert riding the "B" route for no award, that's perfectly acceptable to me too.

my quote

if he doesn't want to ride with the other experts and ride the easy route, then surely that's ok?

With your sensibility and eloquence, I think you should write to the TC at the SACU offices with your suggestions. (If you are who I think you are ) I have done so in the past and got things changed (e.g. licences running until the end of January) D

To idmcc_sec - as Popeye used to say "I yam who I yam" but I don't think I yam who you think I yam!!!!. (must be a clue there somewhere).

There's someone else posts on TC that I used to think might be who you might think I am but now I'm not so sure who s/he is either because it very definitely isn't who I thought it was.

Touche.

G, You may be who you think you are but I think you're someone else! Your member name gave me a clue but I could be a little off track. D

To all the dissenters

Late last year, the SACU sent out a licenceholders newsletter. There is a report from the TC chairman and mentions a few things. Obviously you could not have read it as it states,

"The upgrading system we use has been in position for many years now and may be in need of modernisation! Any proposals to the office please for consideration by the Trials Committee"

Response - NIL

Gav/REv'er/techo -

Does Fort William High School have bikesheds? I'm starting to think maybe Big John and Overthehill should meet behind them in May and sort this out

Apathy is a terrible thing!

I can't be bothered with Apathy.