desertrat28 Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Today first time starting out in 1st, shifted to 2nd, rear wheel locked up (almost put me over the bars!). Restarted and things were fine , but while riding, heard a loud clunk from the gearbox while shifting from 1st to 2nd. Everything normal after that for a few minutes, shifted up to 3rd, another clunk and it stuck in 3rd gear. Won't shift up or down engine on or off. Clutch works, allowed me to start and ride back to the barn in 3rd, but won't shift. Bike won't roll (engine off) just drags rear tire which is locked up. If I put pressure on rear of bike, it gets enough traction to roll in gear. 2004 Beta Rev 3 270cc. Gear oil at proper level in window. Any ideas as to where to start would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir dabs alot Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Have you had the bike or is this the first time you have ridden it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 No matter what it sounds like you're in for a case split. Either something is bent like a shift fork or broken and floating around in the case like a gear tooth. Locking up the wheel while shifting often means something jammed in the gears or the shifting mechanism is trying to engage two speeds at the same time. Happened to me on a Hyundai. Very exciting at speed I assure you. The only way to know for sure is to split the cases. It can't be ignored because even if it frees up there is an extremely high risk of blowing the transmission apart, literally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat28 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys. I've only had it for about a week and have a hour or so on it. Had to replace the woodruff key right off, but things had been fine until yesterday when the trans decided to stick in 3rd. I'll post up what I find out after tearing into it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 1 week? Ouch. I'd have a serious talk with whoever you bought it from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat28 Posted January 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I started by draining the gear oil and found a large piece (pencil eraser size) of what appeared to be a tooth stuck to the magnetic drain plug, so I omitted removing the side cover and pulled the engine. Split the cases, found 1st gear in pieces (broken in half) and 5th with a few teeth rounded off. Looks like the gear just let go and bounced around in the gearbox then jammed up the works. Luckily (if you can call jamming in 3rd gear lucky) only minor damage to the inside of the case and both shafts appear to be in good shape. Not looking forward to the total of the repair bill, but in too deep to stop now. Dan, in response to your suggestion I speak to the seller, both this and the woodruff key going south so soon is, although suspicious, can both be explained away as just one (two) of those things. I've been told that breaking a gear is not common, but not unheard of. Me thinks the previous owner didn't properly torque the flywheel when changing out the stator, which lead to the woodruff key shearing, but I'll never know for sure. Yeah, I'd like to have some recourse, I paid a fair price and should have gotten something that would run for longer than the few hours I've had it run. So goes life, nobody died so things are good. Still looking forward to actually getting to ride instead of working on my first trials bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I've been around Betas a long time and only seen a gear tooth in the oil once on my buddies bike. Wasn't the whole tooth just a shard off the top. Still it went back to Ron Commo for a health check. Other then that I'm unaware of a Beta breaking it's gearbox. I think if you ride one like an MX bike it's possible since the gearbox isn't as stout as an MX bike but it's pretty rare to have that kind of failure. The only other scenario that I can think of is jamming the shifter on a rock but that rarely happens at the kind of throttle neede to shatter a gear. Usually that shatters the rider as well. I did have one guy, that wanted to test ride a bike I had for sale, stand up on the pegs and pound down on the shifter as my friends and I watched in horror. When I said, "WHAT ARE YOU DOING!!!???" He calmly replied with a "Well duh." expression, "I'm trying to start it." Fortunately the bike was fine as the shifter just flexed and his foot rolled off but I can assure you he won't be riding any more of my bikes. Come to think of it he's the best friend of the guy with the broken gear tooth I mentioned earlier. Hmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moulder75 Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 I had an 08 250 rev 3 which the gearbox broke in a similar fashion to what desertrat28 experienced. Luckily it was still under guarantee at BVM as it was only 3 months old. This happeneded while the bike was on tickover with no obvious abuse in the past to cause the fault. Beta UK covered all the costs which was very helpful as the break occured 3 weeks before Scotland. After a lot of stress and worry the bike was fixed with a few days to go before Scotland. The bike was then fine unitl I sold it before Christmas. I think my first gear shaft snapped in half taking out a few other gears. Either way credit must go to BVM and JLI for there excellent service and support. Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat28 Posted February 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 The repair bill ended up at $665 US so the "fair" price I paid for my 04' Beta just went up. The short time I've had it (less than 2 hrs ride time) with this repair puts the hourly operation costs over $300 @ hr! The bright side is I'll start bringing that figure down with hopefully trouble free riding from here on out. Another issue was the previous owner wasn't diligent in getting the head pipe bolts straight and cross-threaded one for me. A tap and some crossed fingers fixed that, but need to pay special attention to that area as it is a bit tight to see that threaded hole. Maybe next time I'll go new, (warranty would've been nice), but since this is a new variant of motorcycle riding to me, thought I'd go used to try it out. Thanks for this forum to exchange ideas and get tips on maint and training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
29ty Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 I recently repaired a friends 08 250 with a similar fault. Failed rockclimb bike slides down finds grip and fires itself on full song to land on the gear lever. I stripped the crunchy box to find the only damage was the 1st gear on the layshaft had shattered. Lucky no bits had affected anything else. So maybe the box isn't over strong if you have a mishap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betarick Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 im starting 2 wonder if beta went cheap on the 08 rev3! as my brothers siezed up doing the scott which was down to crank bearings? then you hear of gears letting go! end of model evo on its way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat28 Posted January 18, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2010 I'm updating this original thread to help vindicate Betas. History repeated itself twice (broken gears) until we discovered that the new style 1st gear had been installed by a previous owner without utilizing the supplied new shaft. This shaft has slightly different splines that engage first gear and installing one without the other spells disaster (and expensive repair bills) in short order. The moral to this story is, when you tear into a bike that you didn't buy new, don't assume anything! Suspect every part inside that trans when rebuilding it and you keep in mind you may have to purchase a new shaft to have one to compare. There is virtually no way to tell if you have the new or old shaft unless you compare and put a mic on them to tell the difference. The comparison of the gears is straight forward enough, the old gears had a spoke like pattern IIRC and the new style has an alternating triangle shape next to a round hole repeated around the interior of the gear. Don't take my word on this, check with someone more knowledgeable to be sure. Another issue we found is that the previous case cracker had not put the correct thickness shaft end shims in so check those also. All this new found knowledge was gained at high expense of both dollars and frustration so be diligent in checking out your parts before re-assembly. The bike has been back together for about 6 mos now and no issues, works and runs great and trials is as fun and challenging as I envisioned it would be. Just wish it hadn't been so expensive (and I got a deal on repairs) to figure out what I'd bought. Next time I'll buy new unless I really trust the previous owner. Used buyers beware and yes.... Beta's are AOK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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