125Cc Restriction For Under 16S

[dadof2]

Now that trials seem to be moving back towards non stop perhaps it is time to reviw the 125cc restriction. Many lads are adult size by the time thy are 14 and could hapily ride a 250, they are after all permitted to ride motocrossers with much more power, height ad weight than a 250 cc trials bike.

125s do not suit no stop riding and tend to be more expensive and more worn than 250s.

Anyone any thoughts?

Cheers

[telecat]

This is to do with Licence limitations with regard to 16 year olds. It pretty much works as well. Riders cannot rely on power to get themselves out of trouble they have to learn how to actually ride themselves out of problems.

[breagh]

Eh,a lot of adult's should be riding 125s too if that we're to be followed through.

[dadof2]

I may be mistaken but my understanding was that the ACU introduced this 125 limit as 250s became more powerfull and the ACU felt this could get younger riders into difficulty.

I have come across a few 14 / 15 year olds who have quit or are considering quiting trials because their 125s are "gutless" when ridden clutch always engaged / no stop style as they are having to. One of these lads is over 6ft tall and 14 + stone.

There are other 14/15 years olds who have bought 250s or bigger for messing about on the fell or their friends farm who would like to try trialing but are not going to change down to a 125 to do so.

In Karting you are alowed diferent power outputs depending on weight to even up performance - this is achieved by inlet restrictors.

Back to trials I think there is a lack of suitable bikes for small riders as well schoolboy riders as well. They want a 125 so they have enough poerr but could do with smaller wheels and lower seat height, also lwer rear mudguard so they can get their leg over easier..

Cheers

[telecat]

No it's was a harmonisation with the rest of Europe and the world. 125's Used to be C class with A and B being 250. The rest of Europe had changed to 125 for under 16 riders with the Euro Youth Champs being 125 only. A youth once they reach 16 CAN ride a unrestricted as an adult Novice/Clubman but if they are wishing to participate in Youth calsses they have to ride 125.

I understand the problems. But they can be mad to work and the FACT that the rider has to work the Bike not expect the engine to get them out of trouble does mean they ride better.

[rabie]

in pre65 (and now i think twinshock) you can ride a bigger bike (detail in handbook somewhere)

in AMCA trials you can ride a 250 at 14

in mx, grass track, H&H, road race, etc, etc we put younger kids on bigger cc *and* more powerfull bikes (anyone seen the power of an 85cc mx bike?)

while there is certainly an argument for keeping kids on 125's till they are 16 (be it to keep costs down, improve skills, or for some euro parity thing)

down here in the silly south east this "issue" is high (top?) on a list that is causing many of our clubs aingst - to the point several are jumping ship (ACU to AMCA).

i personally really struggle to see what the problem is of putting 14 & 15 year olds on a 250cc but a lot of clever people down here have been unable to articulate the case sufficently to persuade the rest of you (centres & T&EC) that this is the way to go.

[59cub]

In fact the AMCA allow them on 250's at 13 and if there is a case to be made for a youth to use a larger than a 250 the club can write to the AMCA who will then actually listen to the case, unlike some.

The other ACU sports have youth on over 125's and they actually get to race wheel to wheel in some of them, unlike us, one in a section at a time, at mostly a slow speed, makes you wonder why, unlike some.

[dadof2]

Thanks very much for your replies lads. Some comfort to know my (northern) observations are not isolated cases.

Telecat #5 "FACT that the rider has to work the Bike not expect the engine to get them out of trouble does mean they ride better" No it means a large proportion in this situation don't ride at ACU events at all, worse still some ride where they should not with all the problems that brings for the sport.

Cheers

[telecat]

Thanks very much for your replies lads. Some comfort to know my (northern) observations are not isolated cases.

Telecat #5 "FACT that the rider has to work the Bike not expect the engine to get them out of trouble does mean they ride better" No it means a large proportion in this situation don't ride at ACU events at all, worse still some ride where they should not with all the problems that brings for the sport.

Cheers

No it doesn't. Those who ride outside the sport do so anyway and most have never heard of the ACU, YMSA or AMCA. If that is your attitude you are not going to ride or drive organised motorsport and are one of those pains who make life difficult for the clubs. They are trying to keep land in the face of prats who have "seen" bikes on the land and assume they can ride there anytime, inconveniencing Farmers, land owners and the clubs trying to put on events for the rest of us. There are no more 250's than 125's about at the moment and 125's these days are a lot more powerful than they used to be. My own take on it is that if you cannot use the power properly it does not matter what bike you have. Jack Price for example is no "little" lad, powerful and well built but like most teenagers these days he's not small. But he can stuff many a Expert on his Gas Gas 125.

[breagh]

Regardless of capacity,I would welcome restriction in horsepower across the board.

Physically large riders have a big advantage over their smaller counterparts especially when the going get's tough.

No one ever mentions this,but if power was to be restricted it could reduce there size advantage.

[dadof2]

Telecat, I do not know the situation in Leeds but some other posters down south also feel the 125 limit is a barrier. In this area (N Yorks / Co Durham) the great majority of riders enter the sport after practicing ilegally as I did. When they get a bike they (as you say) know nothing of the ACU etc, they just want to ride bikes and the road is not an option - so its the fells or other unfenced ground. There then comes a time when they see a trial or hear of one through friends or a dealer and fancy a go. It's at this point the 125 limit can cause problems. Whether a 125 teaches you to be a better rider is irrelevant, its the fact that riders are put off or prevented from entering because they can't use the over 125 bike they already have.

Breagh "Regardless of capacity, I would welcome restriction in horsepower across the board" What would be the point of a power reduction?

Cheers

[breagh]

My opinion is that we are all totally over biked.

If the bike's were limited we wouldn't need the extreme sections.

You would have to be pretty handy before a modern125 would make much difference to your riding.

Rode the Loch Lomond at the weekend a trial which you need a bit grunt and 3 of the top 5 were on 125s.

[2stroke4stroke]

I've never followed the argument that the need to rev a 125 silly then slip the clutch (which to me is the way they need to be ridden for demanding sections, which is not using the power properly, as opposed to clutchless feeding in the power on a larger bike) makes you a better rider. Perhaps if you have World aspirations, but that's not who we're talking about. Surely if a 125 fails to get you up something that a bigger motor would have this can only increase the likelihood of injury?

Power outputs are still circa 20 bhp as they were decades ago so no need for a restriction on the amount of power. Style of power delivery perhaps but there's no way to enforce that.

[telecat]

My Lad had to learn how to ride a 125. In most cases at club Trials you hit the same problem again and again. Too many assume that the "power" will get them through when it's using that power correctly that does it. He spent many an trial "tickling" though sections as well as "slipping" the clutch for really big rocks. It has served him well and his technique stands him in good stead on all surfaces. If you are looking for a improvement then money spent on rear suspension and tyres does a better job.