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'07 250Cc Revs Not Dropping? (Added Pics & Video!)


sawtooth
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Just got an '07 Rev3 250cc and have noticed the revs are taking way to long to drop when I let the throttle off making it really noisy and pretty unpleasant to ride :-( The bike sounds very much like a 2-stroke motocross bike being ramped around?! (not good)

I have another thread with some general questions about the bike but i think this problem needs looking at in depth. Someone mentioned either crank seals (allowing air in) or idle set too high, i've turned the idle right down and still have the issue so is it likely to be crank seals? If so, whats the score on changing those, any guides around?

While we're at it, I don't have a handbook and can't find one to download anywhere for the 2007 so in this pic below the red arrow is the idle yes? So what is the green one and what should it be set to? Also is there any other screws on the carb that i need to be setting?

I know the pictures upside down, sorry.

carb_zpse0558a11.jpg

Edited by sawtooth
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If indeed it is doing this it's what I call "Hanging up on the pilot jet"

Meaning the pilot circuit is lean, and it will ring ding ding ding at well above idle for a few seconds before dropping down to idle speed

Does it eventually drop to idle?

If so

Low fuel height

Partially blocked pilot jet

Air leak at intake

Leaking crank seals

So it would start with a proper carb service, I see the intake manifold clamp is not on straight, it may indicate that this has been apart recently?

Yes the red arrow is idle speed, the other is air screw, start at 2 turns out

Edited by 0007
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Have taken the carb out but not really sure what i'm looking for here tbh. Heres two pictures showing what its like with the throttle closed:

Please click images for larger view.

th_20130623_130340_zps5fb92cb0.jpg

th_20130623_130355_zpsf9bc66b1.jpg

This pipe is almost melted shut, could that have anything to do with it?

th_20130623_130454_zps94d2c627.jpg

Also found that the part the floats lift up is a little stiff to get moving from its lower position, is that correct? See video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPuvJE0nWvg&feature=em-upload_owner

Other than that, is there anything else I can check whilst its off? Please be descriptive as am not all that clued up here :-(

If thats it for the carb i'll start looking at crank seals? The engine does sound like its needs the main bearings doing, that wouldnt cause hanging revs would it?

Edited by sawtooth
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If indeed it is doing this it's what I call "Hanging up on the pilot jet"

Meaning the pilot circuit is lean, and it will ring ding ding ding at well above idle for a few seconds before dropping down to idle speed

Does it eventually drop to idle?

If so

Low fuel height

Partially blocked pilot jet

Air leak at intake

Leaking crank seals

So it would start with a proper carb service, I see the intake manifold clamp is not on straight, it may indicate that this has been apart recently?

Yes the red arrow is idle speed, the other is air screw, start at 2 turns out

Low fuel height, whats meant by this and how can i check it?

Blocked pilot, have taken it out and it looks clear

Air leak at intake, have clamped up the jubilee clip tight, anything else to check here?

Leaking crank seals, how can i check that?

I have access to an ultrasonic cleaner, worth dropping the carb in there for a bit?

Just checked and i believe the pilot is 50 and the main 150, that right?

Edited by sawtooth
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Check the beta thread sticky for carb setup, but I assume it ran at some point, I wouldn't adjust the float height just yet unless you know someone else messed with it just prior to it developing this issue

Pull the needle and make sure there is no debris blocking fuel flow

Make sure the manifold has no cracks and the gasket surface is normal looking, the bolts are tight

Leaking crank seals would produce some goo on the mag side and would consume transmission oil on the other

I wouldn't worry about jetting, look for something that has changed, not all things that were there when the bike ran properly

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Thats the thing, ive only just bought it, it seemed ok on a quick test ride hadn't been on a trials bike for a few years so I didn't pick up on the over revving until I got it home and took it for a proper ride.

I cant see any debris in the carb at all now so will check the inlet manifold for cracks and then move on to crank seals.

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If the pilot jet is 50 something's odd. Stock was a 30 and most people around New England near sea level changed to a 27.5. I believe the stock main is a 140. Before you go after the crank seals check the intake manifold for splits and make sure there are no casting defects in the inlet tract. Check the reeds while you have it apart. Reed petals don't need to be sitting absolutely flat as air pressure will close them but they shouldn't be frayed or cracked/broken.

When you shut the idle screw all the way down the engine should just die on zero throttle. The other screw is an air intake for the pilot circuit in the carb. It's fed from one of the holes in the intake bell. When you clean the carb remember to run compressed air through the carb body after all the screws, jets, fiddly bits are out. I find it best to just disassemble on a paper towel so I don't lose any pieces. Don't run wire or anything harder than monofilament fishing line through a jet as you can scratch it and change the jet size. The tubes on the side that get melted are vents for the float bowl and are the cause of the famous Beta peeing gas syndrome. Nipper a small hole in the tube about halfway up the carb body to stop the carb from leaking.

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My mistake, now the pilot is clean I can see its a 30. Reeds look OK too. Have replaced the rubber boot between the carb and engine with a new one and so far in the garden that seems to have made loads of difference, I think its almost back to normal. Will try raising the floats a little too if that might help?

Also any pics of modding the vent tubes to stop the dam fuel leaking?

Edited by sawtooth
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Well from a mechanical perspective it's fixed to its not

The likelyhood of you having a leaking intake AND a second problem with the same symptom is very slim

Something seems fishy

if the bike ran well previously then adjusting the float height is not a repair

Look for cause and effect, changing the effect by adjusting something that is not the cause is not going to work, it just gets you further from the cause by masking the symptom/effect if you know what I mean

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