funtrials

So can we assume that the person who flipped off another rider (with a picture) in a recent thread would be MORE likely to be banned than someone who strongly expresses their opinion on a controversial topic, but who has not resorted to such tactics? (Not that I'm calling for his being banned.)

Spanish riders don't seem to like no-stop as much as the Brits generally might, I believe. Brits back in the day, like Jarvis and Dougie, were better at no-stop type of riding that they were, all things being equal, at stop-allowed type of sections. Maybe Dougie winning two more outdoor titles than INDOOR titles shows me that. Jarvis loved the no-stop type of slippery sections (won 3 of 6 world rounds at one point!), vs. the indoor grippy/stop/hop type of stuff (he never won an indoor world round, I believe.) Saunders was the same way, I believe? Spanairds practice in dry grippy/stop/hop type of sections, but in, say, Kent, uh, different story (more of a no-stop type of terrain.) I'm NOT holding this against the Brits. NO Nazi comparisons for Dibs, or any other rider, as I completely respect their opinion....and I also think they don't want to be the recipient of a sternly worded letter from the FIM like Raga was, threatening their livelihood, so I assume they are "approving" of the new rules just to "get along". (But see my point above about the British riders.) I don't blame them. Allowed to REALLY tell us how they feel, I think more would be against the straight-jacket on their freedoms that the FIM is imposing on them in pursuit of the almighty dollar. My rage is towards the FIM, not their victims. It seems the FIM's dream is to turn our sport into a slower version of the Scott Trials.

They COULD have stopped/hopped, because stop-allowed rules were in place for many years in world trials, off and on. They just weren't talented enough to do it, apparently. It is interesting to see how, last year when the fun rules were in place, how riders like Bou/Raga could ride circles around Martin/Vesty in terms of what they can do today vs. what those guys could do in the mid 70's. I watched world rounds with Rathmell/Coutard et al back in the day, and it's great that the sport has progressed (except for the FIM wanting to take us back to those days) so far. Today's riders are gods (when the FIM doesn't take way their super-powers) compared to the mere mortals of yester-year. The clutches, the lightness of the bikes(!), the suspensions, the more powerful motors, grippier tires, the weight-training/nutrition, and the new riding techinques, etc. all have contributed to that, son I'm NOT trying to impune the old riders personally. I'm sure that 2027 World Champion Alfie Lampkin will make Mr. Bou of today look about as bad as Alfie's dad makes ME look today. I couldn't even flip the back end of my Fantic around in 1983 as an in-shape 20 year old, but now as a real old fat geeser I CAN do it on my GasGas! The new Factory Replica Gassers, that the public can buy, are what, 140 pounds...but the TL250's were less powerful, and weighed 230 pounds! My TL125 had a pathetic weight-to-power ratio compared to today's new hotness. I love progress. Hopefully the FIM does not pine for days gone by.

Obviously it's because their beer legally has a higher alcohol content than the USA does. :-)

About 23 years old is the peak median age for world trials, traditionally, so unlike the older riders who are in their 30's right now, I think Dibs will steadily be moving up over the next couple years. His podium at the last round in 2012 gave me some hope.

Can't roll backwards, can't hop the whole bike sideways, can't hop the front end sideways (if stopped for a split second), can't hop the back end sideways, can't restart my engine if I come to a stop, can't hop on my back wheel in place for even a second, and now a FEE has to be paid for just listing my manufacturer's name in the RESULTS....I think my Nazi analogy is being proven more and more correct, right guys?

No, I promise you I'm not Lane at all. Interestingly, I did subscribe to his "Trane With Lane" (if we're talking about the same "Lane") newsletter back in the day. Small world.

I've actual used that formula recently to determine distance between two towns (if I know the lat/long coordinates) in a group that I do volunteer work for. Good thing I paid attention in school. (Kids, let this be a lesson to you.) :-)

I'm not saying it's the observer's fault. It's the FIM's fault. Rolling back with your feet up used to be legal (1997+- I think).

Truth be told, the Canadians I've met are exceptional trials riders AND exceptional people.

I just might also be able to whip up some statistics that prove conclusivley that Rosie O'Donnell is more attractive than super-model Gisele Bündchen is. It won't be easy, but I think I can do it (hey, if statistics like in the OP can show that we Americans are just as good of trials riders as the Japanese are then hey, no problem!)

Recently, yes. But in the not too-distant past people like Dougie and Jordi and Jarvis, et al could legally roll back for no penalty (if they kept their feet up at least.)

Good work, as that's all we can really ask of the observers.

Play nice. In defense of kramit, I assume that his point was that intrepretations vary from observer to observer (regardless of what the rules are), because we're dealing with human beings - so we have to just live with that to a fair degree, and also that what the observer gives is *indeed* the right answer - that's basically how it works, it's up to the observer. What the rules SHOULD be is likely the main issue of the thread, but he arguably was not direclty addressing that issue in his post (which is fine.)

So it seems that the decent, honest followers of the new rules are the ones that loose out. Sad, really.

Thanks for observing.

The same ones who have built them every year that stop/hop/fun was allowed. PS, I prefer free enterprise over Socialism.

From: http://en.wikipedia....ld_Championship Fifty percent more British riders (6) have won the world outdoor title than Spanish riders (4). "Spanish domination"?? WHAT "Spanish domination"!? In terms of total titles, there have only been four riders in history that are better than Marc Colomer. I did not know that. So Colomer is, by that metric, better than all of these riders: -Fuji -Sammy Miller Products -LeJeune -King Bernie -The FIM trials council member from France who I don't really like right now -Vesty -Mick Andrews -Cabestany -The UK Sherco importer who really chewed out the UK GasGas importer last year on Trials Central about the Dibs/Brown issue. -Ahvala -Alfie Lampkin's Grandfather -Don Smith -Franke -Karlson -Bernie's brother in law The indoor series has been running for 21 years, and a there have only been TWO individuals that were not from SPAIN to ever score world titles indoors (Dougie and Ahvala). I’m going to start drinking bottled water from Spain, because it must be “something in the water” that makes them so good at riding around with their feet up! This millenium, only 1 manufacturer (with only one rider) besides Montesa Honda has won the outdoor world title. Ossa, Zundapp, and Greeves each have more world titles than Sherco, or SWM, or Scorpa. WTF!? The USA, and Sweden, and that perennial power-house of world trials - Germany, each have more world titles than the Italians. Sorted by total wins (just click on the column header) indoors, Spain, in the top 7, has 250% more than the rest of the world COMBINED. (Does trials training begin in the WOMB in that country?) Laia is a goddess, obviously. Can you name ANY other sport where someone has won it every year but one? No, you can’t. Can you name ANY other sport were someone was world champion 12 different years?....Schumacher (nope), Michael Jordon (nope), Tiger (nope)...... Come on, admit it, none of you knew that the world trials championship used to actually be called “Challenge Henry Groutards”. :-) A Spanish rider has won the last TWELVE indoor world titles, and counting! All but 7 of the last 26 years have been won by just THREE different guys. Gods, in my opinion. Finland, France, German, and Belgium each have more world titles than the Japanese. FINLAND has more world titles than any other country in trials history (except for Britain and Spain.) WTF!? At the last world round, ONE country (Spain - surprise!) had 5 times as many riders in the top ½ dozen spots as the rest of the other 230 countries in the entire world combined.....COMBINED. Britain has more outdoor titles (17) than any other country. So arguably Britain is the best trials country in history? Si! So if you're British, stand up right now, hold up a pint, and repeat proudly "Viva Britainia, we're the best trials riders in the world!" The USA and Sweden each have as many world titles as the Japanese. (So let's just assume that we Americans are just as good of trials riders as the Japanese, ok? Ok, good, I'm glad we settled that argument.) In all those years, there was only one rider who won an indoor title but never an outdoor title (Cabestany, one of my favorite riders.) I like Sherco, but they’ve never won a world title (not YET at least.) Scorpa has won more. Fujinami (maybe my favorite rider) has more “runner up” titles than maybe anyone in any sport, ever. It doesn’t list that here, but can someone tell us how many times he was “runner up”? I THINK he’s been #2 more times than any trials rider has ever been #1. Look, maybe we Americans should probably stick with with what we're good at....say, motocross.....or shooting people......or saving the French from the Germans – look, I don’t really know, I'm just saying... Look, I'm trying to be POSITIVE here, so, uh, let me just say it this way: Canadians, and Russians, and Norwegians are really really good at hockey. HOCKEY. I love my GasGas, which is maybe currently the world wide leader in trials sales, but interestingly, only ONE lone rider has ever won an indoor title on a GasGas, which is the same number of riders as have won it on that trials juggernaut known as Aprilia (yes, Aprilia.) A Spanish manufacturer has won the manufacturer’s award every year this millenium. From: http://www.fim-live....orld-champions/ The Italians and the Outer Mongolians have each won exactly the same number of world trials titles. I know you're all quite surprised by this, but it's actually true. I'm not joking here, seriously, they have NOT even done better than the Italians. Bultaco holds the record for most consecutive wins, and they incredibly did it with FOUR DIFFERENT riders in that period. Viva Bultaco! To make things more FAIR, can we just all agree that from now on we’re going to just BAN the Spanish from world trials, mkay? What other interesting facts can you point out from this?

The FIM rules can often trickle down to the local level.

"I gotta go out and win ANOTHER world title, but I'm getting kind of bored doing that all the time...."

Re: Andorra Pro Class: a changing of the guard? Yes, I think it's now official. I always thought it would be some here-to-fore-unknown young kid who came into his own as he turned 20 years old who would be the one to finally end Bou's run, but all this time he was a relatively old guy (in this 30's), lurking in the #2 position.

Hopping SIDEWAYS with FORWARD motion kind of defeats the purpose, don't you think?

What's so evil about stopping for a few seconds here and there with an overall time penalty in place!?

Techincally, if the observers are consistent, hopping sideways, or hopping the front or rear wheel sideways is NOT legal. Watch that FIM observer video, then you'll see how Nazi-like these new rules are. Also, most re-starting of the bike takes place in a section when the bike is STOPPED (the motor is dead!) for at least a split section (verbotten!), so your point is not realistic. Watch the two videos of Bou and Fuji unfairly get FIVES for brilliantly re-starting their bikes (Bou in Japan, Fuji in USA) and you'll see how ridiculous the new rules are. Demanding that a trials rider never stop for a split second in a section is like demanding that a road racer never go fast.

Yes, I do believe that twinshocked is a fine rider and is a credit to our sport in many ways. We just have different visions of where trials should be in the future, that's all. Me personally, if I was handcuffed in the sections with the ridiculous new rules, I'd probably quit the sport.