p@ul250
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I build new sidecars and also do a refurbishment and fitting service. For a brand new chair fully fitted to your bike, you are looking at around £2000 > £2500 depending on the wheel/brake option. Yes very easy for a father/son team to ride, there are a few father/son father/daughter teams around. Normal minimum age for rider or passenger is 16 years old. But it is possible to get a dispensation from the ACU for a passenger of 14 years old. But you would need to talk with them and meet some requirements regarding experience of driver/ passengers previous riding etc. Recommended bike would be, the newer the better Road registered (as a lot of the nationals are road based) and a 300 2T if possible, but a 250 will cope with most things.
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Yes, after every three rides is about right. I change mine after every National trial (road based events) or after three local events/practice rides. And yes Transmax Z does discolor and it's nothing to worry about. On a side note I have had my clutch plates last two and a half years using only Transmax Z and pulling a sidecar from new. I used to run Beta Evo's and would need new plates at least once a year.
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My 2017 300 Combat came new with 9:38 sprockets fitted and my 2017 300 Ice Hell 10:42. Both give the same 4.2 to 1 gearing i have gone to a 9:40 set up on the Combat as it's pulling a sidecar.
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It's because we spend our time out riding them. As pointed out Australian chairs are totally different to what we use over here in the UK. so what works for us here may be totally wrong for others. That said, here is what is the normal set up here in the UK. Track of outfit:34.5" (this is the minimum allowed under ACU rules). sidecar wheel leading rear wheel by between 9.5" & 10.5" and toed in by 1.5" over the wheel base of the bike. Bikes rear shock fitted with a spring of around 900 to 1000 lbs per inch and sidecar shock (with 2" travel) with a 130 or 150 lbs spring depending on passenger size. I like to use the optional heavy duty spring in my front forks and I also use 10 w fork oil. As for gearing the bike down, I use a rear sprocket that is a couple of teeth bigger than stock. That's about as far as I'll take it today, but if people have specific questions they are welcome to contact me.
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Paul
Just finalising my measurements.
Have seen contradictory methods for measuring toe-in. Can you confirm your measurements are over the bike's wheel base (i.e. distance between the axles) rather than the overall length of the bike, as appears often on-line.
Would seem more logical to me to be the wheelbase as it is the touch points of the three tyres that seem critical, but I just wanted to check.
Thanks
Stuart
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Hi
I can see now why these trials chairs come up regularly on ebay as unfinished projects!
I have decided to completely redo all the mountings as they come off the chair in entirely the wrong directions, and they were a bodge anyway by the previous owner.
Was going to use pipe with the same dimensions as what is there already. Am looking at mild steel CDS is this OK or is there something stronger/lighter?
The chair has a 17" wheel. If it were 18" mountings would be more level (and possibly easier, and more aesthetically pleasing), and the outfit would have more ground clearance. Is there any disadvantage is changing to an 18" wheel, apart from the expense!
Thanks for your help.
Stuart
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Hi Stu, sorry for the delay in replying (I don't come on this forum very often). CDS tube is fine as long as it's not HP hydraulic tube. I use BS 4 T45 tube which is MSA approved for role cages)tube (25mm x 1.5mm) for the main frame tubes on the chairs I build and ERW tube (20mm x 1.5mm) for the nose and rear deck.
All modern trials sidecars use a 17" wheel, ether one from a Honda cub C90 with a hub brake or a more modern 17" alloy rim laced to a Hope mountain bike hub with a disc brake set up. The disadvantage of an 18" wheel is it's extra weight
What bike are you fitting the chair to? have you tried razing the nose of the chair up? you will will find that this will push the wheel down and should increase the ground clearance. Call me on 07491642421 or email me at pdjtcollins@yahoo.co.uk
yellow outfit has Cub wheel and the green one a Hope MTB hub with disc
If you really get stuck I do do a sidecar fitting service
Regards Paul C
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Hi Stu,
Just seen your post in which you say you think your chair is a Beamish. If so your chair was designed to use an 18" wheel and yes you will have a lot less ground clearance than you will have with a more modern sidecar design. This is Chris Newsham with a Beamish chair fitted to a modern Gas Gas. He ran it for one year before coming to me for a newer chair (second photo)
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Even if it's possible DON'T BOTHER! It does nothing except make the bike harder to start.
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Hi Stu, If you get the geometry correct you shouldn't need adjustable mounts. But do make the sidecar detachable. The most important dimensions are, Track of 34.5",Wheel lead (sidecar wheel spindle 9.5" > 10" ahead of rear wheel spindle) and a toe in of 1.5" over the wheel base of the bike. I set mine in a jig that I built. The bikes suspension is unloaded and fitted with the heavy duty rear spring. For a modern mono bike your looking at around a 900 lbs per inch spring (so you may find that your air shock will struggle). The tires are at working pressure and the bike set vertical in the jig. Most of the sidecars used have the sidecar wheel vertical or cambered in a little and the vast majority have a suspension geometry that increases the camber in as the sidecar suspension is compressed. These are just a few I have done in the last few years.
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Vertigo don't list the filter as a part, only the complete pump assembly. I did a google search for Mahle KL97 and came up with loads of options here in the UK. You could use this kit as the strainer is also the same as the one on the Vertigo. Only thing is these hose crimps are to small for the hoses used on the Vertigo. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-Mahle-Filter-KL97-OEM-Strainer-Kit-for-KTM-75007088111-7500708211/112962428495?epid=8018589804andhash=item1a4d15de4f:g:YTEAAOSwA4Va4c4O:rk:18:pf:0
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Hi Evo Boy, not a hard job at all. To tell you the truth the hardest part was getting water pump bracket over to the side enough to get the the fuel tank top/pump assembly out. once it's out its just a case of cutting the single ear hose crimps and then pop the hoses off each end. You will need two new hose clips to fit the new filter with, ideally single ear hose crimps. I think they are 12mm (I happened to have an assorted box), or you could maybe get away with a couple of high torque hose clamps (bare in mind that the pump supplies up to 3.5 bar).
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Well it turned out to be the (throttle position sensor (TPS) had failed, new one from Vertigo UK is £33.40. I did check the fuel pump and lines as suggested and when in there I changed the in tank fuel filter. It's a Mahle KL97 the same as is used on the KTM 250, 350,450 EXC and loads of other fuel injected bikes. After two years the filter was looking pretty grotty and they can be had for around £16.00 here in the UK (KTM recommend changing theirs every 50 hours).
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So thirteen sidecars attended the trial in Essex from as far afield as Cheshire. Three of the crews were brand new to the sport and are now planning on joining the rest of us at the first round of the ACU Wessex plant hire British sidecar championship. https://www.acu.org.uk/events/March-2019/Normandy-MCC/Trials/Sethern-Rams-Lane-Dunsfold-Surrey-ACU55302.aspx
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First round of the ACU Eastern sidecar trials Championship takes place this coming Sunday. It's an open trial. The Venue is Poles wood, Kelvedon Hatch, Brentwood, Essex. CM14 5TL. Sign-on from 09:00 for a 10:30 start. Entry closes at start and sidecar entry fee is £20.00 https://www.acu.org.uk/events/February-2019/Southend-DMCC/Trials/Poles-Wood-Great-Myles-Farm-ACU55650.aspx
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Cheers Peter, I'll check the fuel pressure and if low I'll pull the fuel pump out of the tank and have a look, Paul C.
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Out for a ride This morning and my 2017 300 combat started blubing and running like a bike running low/out of fuel (it had a full tank). It cleared for a bit and then as soon as I started opening the throttle it would bog, but would tick over fine. I stopped the bike and then it wouldn't restart. After a long push back to the van I changed the plug (Had a good spark) and swapped battery, but It still wont start. I can hear the fuel pump cycle when I set the start button. So I'm thinking Injector blocked or a fuel pressure issue. Has anyone else had something similar? Any practical advice?
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Combination opportunity in the East? And which bike
p@ul250 replied to Totalnovice's topic in Sidecar Trials
Hi Totalnovice, I can confirm that the Norwich Vikings & Norfolk & Suffolk Juniors are welcoming to sidecars (I ride them when I can) and that Southend & District Mcc run a proper sidecar class and have three rounds of the Centre championship planned for 2019. They are 17th Feb, 7th April and 6th October and all are at Poles wood, Brentwood. There are currently only three or four active sidecar crews in East Anglia at the moment. But we do get guys coming up from Kent & Sussex to the Southend trials and if you don't mind traveling we do have a British championship with a clubman & a newcomers class. There are 11 rounds in 2019 with the first one being in Surrey on the 3rd March. Trials sidecar outfits are like hens teeth. But if you are looking for a twinshock, you can't get better than a proper Beamish Suzuki RL outfit and if you decide that you want one built, then give me a call, as I build quite a few outfits (six last year alone) and do currently have a second hand chair in stock and I tend to know when others come up for sale. If you would like to try out a modern sidecar outfit, I'm in Lowestoft, Suffolk and we have a great practice ground just up the road at The Trials Park, Corton, Suffolk. First photo was taken at a N&SJ Mcc trial in Suffolk, second in the Isle of Man at the Manx two day trial.
