Week 36 - Why Trials Can Be A Drag!

[Andy]

A controversial headline don

[scorpa3]

Thanks for your very interesting perspective of the TDN Mike. I feel a 'non stop for all' debate looming

[steveo]

Im up around your age Mike and the scene you describe is what I have been thinking for many years.

The 70's trials style of riding is now not recognised as a skill, if your not doing death defing obstacles you really are just a hacker, or so it seems.When Andy posts the vids of the womens riding I do see the sections as a course you can more relate to and see how very good these woman are.

The best redeeming point between the two different forms of motorcycle trials is knowing your capabilities and the satisfaction you do derive from being on your bike and enjoying ridng it, no matter what your age !

[atomant]

Good article Mike and a subject we flirt with regularly

I think this comment below is worth expanding!

....I'm not degrading Doug, far from it, he's a star, and performing in the manner which will bring him the greatest success,....

The riders will ride what's in front of them in a way that will bring them the greatest success. This suggests that the CoC (who needs the right terrain of course) can influence greatly how they ride a section. That may sound obvious but you see many sections of a similar type these days at this level. i.e , lots of little elements that make up one section as Mike suggests above.

Could it be possible to make a tough enough 'traditional' flowing section for them, terrain permitting ?

[bilco]

Good article Mike and a subject we flirt with regularly

I think this comment below is worth expanding!

....I'm not degrading Doug, far from it, he's a star, and performing in the manner which will bring him the greatest success,....

Could it be possible to make a tough enough 'traditional' flowing section for them, terrain permitting ?

This is where they've lost the plot,A Trial is'nt just about the section's,it's about man and bike in the middle of a moor fighting to get to the next section without breakdown, injury and without losing too much time,take them into consideration and the ease of the traditional section would even thing's out.

[adsy]

It

[kinell]

So can your average club road race rider relate to Casey Stoner, Rossi etc doing the lap times that they do?

Should we slow them down so that they can 'relate to it'.

The same can be said for MXGP, Formula 1, and any other 'professional sport' for that matter.

Its about time the Flat Cap Brigade moved with the times, and stopped trying to drag the sport back to 'the good old days'.

The skills shown at any WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP event in any sports discipline are for the best in the world and should be a world away from what your average rider would be able to even attempt, never mind get through.

That is why all sports, motorsport or otherwise has its Stars, 'Dougie, Bou, Rossi, Hamilton' etc because they are the best in the world at what they do, and continue to push the envelope in there relative sports.

Why is it that trials seems to be the only sport that is determined to DUMB down the top level, so 'we can all have a go'.

We have events such as The Scott, Scottish etc, and long may they continue, where Joe Bloggs can 'compete' alongside some of the top riders in the world, but for Gods sake leave the profesional side of the sport to get on with it!

Spot on

[phb]

[

Just go and watch the fantastic skills of these riders. At the moment we have a fantastic crop of young riders, in not so many years time it will the British TDN team that is going round for single figures and the rest of the world that is playing catch up

having watched the likes of brown and the other up and coming stars of future british riders at skyrakes yesterday it will be a long time before we will be able to compete with the current crop of riders from spain, Dont get me wrong they are good riders, but they are far from consistant and need to be beating the likes of Graham Jarvis on a regular basis.

[ishy]

I understand what Rappers is saying, trials at world level has evolved way past what the sport once used to be about, in fact I don't think it was ever intended to be anything more than a clubman's sport.

After reading Adsy's reply though, I have to admit he's correct in saying it would be the wrong move to hobble the top riders.

No one seems to be able to come up with an answer on how to make world level trials both challenging for the top 6 riders, make it appealing to public and still make it possible for those who are very good but just not good enough to also compete.

When comparing with other motor sports, you have to keep in mind if your not has fast as Rossi, your just that, not has fast, in trials, if your not spot on your going to be doing a bit of crashing.

If world trials bears no resemblance to the sport of trials, is it about time it did go it's own way with name, rules, and format, maybe the problem is the flat hat's are trying to hold on to what the sport is about, when we should be letting it go it's own path, just don't call it observed trials.

I think the answer is in the gate trial, or open free trial has the French call it, because it allows more riders to ride the same course but only the top few will attempt the silly stuff, and the younger end can learn the game without killing themselves, I would go with the stricter scoring rules though, in only a clean ride get's scored, none of this partial stuff.

[adsy]

Ishy Posted Today, 05:12 PM

I understand what Rappers is saying, trials at world level has evolved way past what the sport once used to be about, in fact I don't think it was ever intended to be anything more than a clubman's sport.

As was Golf, started by some lord in scotland or summat with a lump of pig and a stick!

As was F1, started by some rich toffs with far too much money.

As was Football, with lumps of Sheep and a grass field.

Just like all of the sports named above (and virtually every other), Observed Motorcycle Trials HAS evolved.

Unfortunately some poeple involved in the sport refuse to evolve with it.

Edited October 8, 2007 by Adsy

[ishy]

After reading Adsy's reply though, I have to admit he's correct in saying it would be the wrong move to hobble the top riders.

You missed a bit Adsy, but unlike all the other sports you mention, trials at world championship level is going down the ****ter.

[dgshannon]

So can your average club road race rider relate to Casey Stoner, Rossi etc doing the lap times that they do?

The same can be said for MXGP, Formula 1, and any other 'professional sport' for that matter.

Yes, they can relate, and that is the point. Anybody, that can ride a motorcycle, could go right out on that MotoGP track, and ride laps around it. And while lap times would be very different, they can relate, because they went through every corner, down every straight, they accelerated, and braked, and rode the bike on the very same track as their heros.

The exact same thing is true of MXGP, Formula 1, etc. But, trials at the World level has nothing at all to do with what my mates and I do, on the weekend. And, if you or I were turned loose in world class sections, we could only stand around and pick our nose, because no matter how many hours of "lap time" they gave us we could not ride, experience, or "relate" to what those guys just did.

Giving it a different name might help, because what those guys do has no relationship at all to the "Observed Trials" events I compete in. And I would wager that to be true of you, and the vast majority of the folks that make up this forum, whether they are an old timer from the "good old days" or a new young hotshot, from the local club.

[atomant]

It

[bilco]

So can your average club road race rider relate to Casey Stoner, Rossi etc doing the lap times that they do?

The same can be said for MXGP, Formula 1, and any other 'professional sport' for that matter.

we could only stand around and pick our nose,

Now im a little confused by this,would he be picking your nose and you be picking he's nose.

[02-apr]

I'm surprised that nobody has raised this before. As a young competitor I would travel the country both to ride and to see the top men in action and find their skills enjoyable to watch. The skill was in not only riding the bike but picking the line. They all seem to use the same line now as Mike said so that's gone.

I would not necessarily expect to relate to what guys over 30 years younger than me are doing but I certainly don't go to many big "modern" trials for one simple reason - it's boring. Once I have seen one rider go up an apparently impossible face then that's it, there's no attraction in seeing another dozen do the same thing. We must be approaching the limits of what is possible, we can't change the laws of physics, and that leaves nowhere to go.

On the comparison with other sports, after not following things that closely, it came as a bit of a surprise to realise this year just how few people are actually riding the full World trials. Does any other sport have a World championship with so few people contesting it?

I will say that I appreciate what it takes to clean a modern World section and well done to anyone with the skills but that doesn't make it interesting enough for me to put in the effort to go and watch. I'd rather be throwing the marks away at a club trial.