monty_jon Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) how is a bike where you can use what you want virtually a cheaper way to enter the sport than a cobbled together bantam etc. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BSA-D7-175cc-BANTAM-SUPER-1960-restoration-/150553731766?pt=UK_Motorcycles&hash=item230db3a2b6 -TYRES-UNUSED-/130479672526?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item1e6131ccce http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Trials-mudguards-fit-Bultaco-Ossa-pre65-universal-ect-/150549183481?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item230d6e3bf9 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Trials-Yamaha-175-cc-Rear-Shocks-/220732264662?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item3364ab10d6 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CLASSIC-MOTORCYCLE-TRIALS-TRAIL-SEAT-/120678005927?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item1c18f83ca7 now chuck in some bars controls sprockets and chain and you 've very rideable bike for a lot less than a grand. why change the rules when you can have a genuine bike for that money.. no fiddle req. Its not quite that simple What about, 21” rim front, WM2 rim rear so the tyre will fit! (Bantam has WM1) folding kick start folding foot pegs heavy weight forks for 21” rim Swing arm (bantam to narrow) Exhaust plus does that bike run???? List goes on, trust me I’m building one! (With OTF's Brit-class I could use Spanish forks, wheels & yokes at a fraction of the price compared to old BSA items) plus the point is it would have to compete with fiddle bikes Edited January 30, 2011 by Monty_Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
htrdoug Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 If you outlawed those fork braces, owner would call them mudguard stays, then you would have to ban probably 20% or more of the entry, who lets not forget have already been accepted based on photographic evidence of their bikes being eligable, for the scottish "pre65" ? Forgive me,I don't recall any fenders(American for mudguards) mounting like that myself,but I do know every idea has already been tried years ago,I do have SSDT 50's video that has a bike that had rear shocks laid down on a 45 degree angle,so would technically seven inches of rear wheel travel would be OK based on photographic evidence? Maybe you could state fork caps must not be connected to any other part inside the forks? No damper rods connected to them. Best to just come up with a set of rules,stick with them,invite those that want to to come out and play under them, then harass and ridicule anyone who goes over the top to build a world beater. Even though I'm a outsider I like the move to BTS rules over pre-65,if I was over there I'd definitely participate!(the price of old cubs over here is too high for my casual tastes,plus buying price is only permission to spend more!)(thought about finding a Harley 165 which looks like a inverted Bantam,but they also go for way too much,damn pirates jacking the price of anything harley!) dad had a garage full of 6 Mountain Cubs when I was a about 12 years old,I wanted one soooooo badly but he said I'd blow the rod outa them and put me on small Italian twostrokes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Its not quite that simple What about, 21 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty_jon Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) from the list it sounds like you want a bike that is competative againstr the current bikes? new exhaust/ wider swing arm/ heavy weight forks etc. i understood that the eligibility issues were to bring costs and the sport more accesable not to make bikes competative against current p65 specials. all these suggested rules will do is encourage the specials builders to go away and build every more special specials. as bikes are developed at present the countries biggest clubs only have to tighten the rules as they are in F1 etc . i saw today a bike with modern fork internals and the adjusters on the top and the rider was pointed out that they were outside the spirit of the rules and that although welcome to ride it would be as a special i also saw a cobbled together bike ' build in progress' with old montesa forks again allowed a ride but as a special and on the understanding that appropriate legs were fitted asap ( in fact a set were at the trial) and what exactly do you see wrong with the aerial above? i guess the yolks may ruffle a feather and the legs look a little unusual but at the ned of the day the bike is ridden by a decent rider and it will win and it is ostensibly british in its construction and appearance i doubt the best rides in your proposed 'class' would ride such a bike. No, I don’t want a special (can’t afford one), if you fit a 21” wheel you need heavy weight forks std bantams are to short (Old standard BSA heavy weight are not trick, try a set!) Same with the swing arm if you want a trials tyre The above mods would not make me competitive,they are the very basic mods just to turn it into a trials bike Edited January 30, 2011 by Monty_Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie prescott Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Hi Guy's, Hi Totalshell, Look I did this exercise last year,Just take a look at "Otter On The Cheap", on my web site. www.bsaotter.com And you will see it does not work out like that. The only thing I may have got down slightly cheaper was the engine unit, but there again I know this is a good unit, and if I had to build one out of bits it would cost at least as much. The Bantam you have put on, from E-bay, will probably go for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broony Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) Totalshell I built a standard D7 Bantam only mod. was 21"front rim and a wider rear,only did one trial on it and it was terrible.Enter Evo 2-chopped frame/sub-frame,Honda XL100 tank,complete GS125 front end(£30 from ebay),electronic ign., homemade exhaust all built in a 8'x4' shed with not alot of money just a wee bit imagination.Still to trial it but its like night and day to ride and didn't break the bank British Twinshocks is the way ahead. cheers the noo Brian Edited January 30, 2011 by broony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Totalshell I built a standard D7 Bantam only mod. was 21"front rim and a wider rear,only did one trial on it and it was terrible.Enter Evo 2-chopped frame/sub-frame,Honda XL100 tank,complete GS125 front end( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack_the_lad Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 At first I thought this topic was going somewhere but now I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) At first I thought this topic was going somewhere but now I Edited January 30, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broony Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Jack the lad,think your missing the point.British twinshocks is a whole new class and if adopted don't think there will be a need for a special class as all bikes will be built on the spec.Also I said that the new bike is "like night and day to ride",that means its far better than the original.Sorry for the lack of titianium ,carbon fibre,billet yokes,chrome moly frame,fiddler forks,expensive alloy tank and trick hubs Ah! that would be Pre 65 . cheers the noo Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) british twin shocks isnt a 'new' class its an open specials class. yes i do have a vested interest i'm a member of the countries largest p65 club and at this years agm a proposal was made to allow twinshocks. i considered the proposal a fair point however after a lengthy and full and frank discussion with viewpoints from all directions heard and respected especially from those founders of the club and many riders from the 40's, 50's and 60's not one person voted for the proposal or abstained from the vote. the vote was unaimous against the proposal. the rules for pre 65 are diverse they lack continuity / universality and clarity they are though what we the riders have chosen, they do however provide us with a class where riders can make a choice of machine and purchase/ make such a machine. cost is an issue in all sports , trials costs money a new monoshock will set you back circa 5k and in a year will have lost Edited January 30, 2011 by totalshell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack_the_lad Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Well I must have hit a nerve? I have what you would call a trick cub and in some peoples eyes is a 6 grand bike. The fact is I built most of it in a garage and small shed. I machined the barrel casting put PVL posts on the crank case ETC. The next bike that is built will have even more home machined parts on it. The bike I have gets a hard life as I am not a very good rider and do not mind admitting that. Anyway I also do machine work for quite a few of the major suppliers. And what makes me laugh is the nonsense that written in how to go about doing things by then talks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 british twin shocks isnt a 'new' class its an open specials class. yes i do have a vested interest i'm a member of the countries largest p65 club and at this years agm a proposal was made to allow twinshocks. i considered the proposal a fair point however after a lengthy and full and frank discussion with viewpoints from all directions heard and respected especially from those founders of the club and many riders from the 40's, 50's and 60's not one person voted for the proposal or abstained from the vote. the vote was unaimous against the proposal. the rules for pre 65 are diverse they lack continuity / universality and clarity they are though what we the riders have chosen, they do however provide us with a class where riders can make a choice of machine and purchase/ make such a machine. cost is an issue in all sports , trials costs money a new monoshock will set you back circa 5k and in a year will have lost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty_jon Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 (edited) OTF, I think you are banging your head against a wall, it's only the people without deep pockets know what mean. The problem is the people with trick bikes dont think it counts if its there trick bike, they will always have some justification that suits the modification Also you may have hit the nail on the head with vested interests Edited January 30, 2011 by Monty_Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack_the_lad Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Just out of interest, in your club, which class would this C15 go which has an original 1959 swan neck frame, unit or specials? And which class would Neil Gaunt's Ariel be allowed into, Pre-unit or specials? Dead simple SPECIALS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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