widrace Posted November 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 try subira, he will have some info It appears that Subira has left the forum without a trace - no posts, nothing! Thanks for all the input so far folks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin belair Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 I'm considering a weight reduction program on my 315r. It would be super to see photos of the things that were done. I did get a chance to look close at Dougies bike at Duluth but like a dummy didn't take any pictures. Martin... if your out there - is there anything you can share now, like the actual final weight and some comments perhaps? I also remember some talk/speculation about the frame being fabricated of thinner stock and 5th gear removed. Come on Martin - time to spill your guts!! Some items I remember: 1) Ti (probably) rear shock body 2) Rear wheel lightened between spokes 3) Misc brackets machined 4) Triple clamps - probably Ti 5) Ti hardware/axles perhaps 6) Header pipe - thin stainless or maybe Ti tubing 7) Bash plate of ??? 8) Carbon filter cover 9) Ti fork legs What about the swingarm - anybody? I did get the small works fuel tank from Subira awhile back and that's my starting point. Any info welcome, Cheers Hi Steve, as much as I can recall - shock body, fork lowers, triple clamps, crankcases, were magnesium. - hubs were turned down - head pipe, hardware, peg brackets, some engine internals were Titanium - frame was very standard, just tailored to Doug's and Fuji style, the webbing inside the ankle area of the frame was cleaned up (saved a few grams) - air box was Kevlar in early years but stock later on - CF fork brace and air box lid - skid plate was standard - I recall that Doug used the standard pegs for many years. most club riders has tricker pegs - they told me that overall weight loss was acheived grams at a time Good luck. I know the winters are long in Michigan and a man needs a project. Martin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montesaman Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 Hi Steve, Martin's comments are consistent with what Dougie told me in 2003. Regarding making lighter - the link to Banjeres is the best you will get as he can source some HRC parts (being Fuji's minder). Going the Ti route you will pay big bucks so I would concentrate on the cheaper upgrades from elsewhere: - use 4RT rear wheel - fits straihght in and weighs about 0.5Kg less I believe - rear X-lite tyre (also saves about 0.5Kg) - Raptor footpegs (and maybe the 4RT ti hangers might fit also) Then if you have more money to spend, look at Ti bolt kits from H&D racing in UK, and possible a Ti Mitani stand which <mention of this company is not permitted on Trials Central> in UK can probably get for you... Future Trial is another possible source as some of their 4RT parts will fit the 315 (and tehir site gives yo the weight saving vs stock) Good luck Montesaman Hi Steve, as much as I can recall - shock body, fork lowers, triple clamps, crankcases, were magnesium. - hubs were turned down - head pipe, hardware, peg brackets, some engine internals were Titanium - frame was very standard, just tailored to Doug's and Fuji style, the webbing inside the ankle area of the frame was cleaned up (saved a few grams) - air box was Kevlar in early years but stock later on - CF fork brace and air box lid - skid plate was standard - I recall that Doug used the standard pegs for many years. most club riders has tricker pegs - they told me that overall weight loss was acheived grams at a time Good luck. I know the winters are long in Michigan and a man needs a project. Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motovintage Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 Seems a lot of work, just to save 2kg's I am thinking the same thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munch Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 yeah, especially when i can save 4kg off a 4rt without too much work!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgshannon Posted November 11, 2010 Report Share Posted November 11, 2010 Seems a lot of work, just to save 2kg's Exactly my thought, as well. Always laugh at the arguments over a few kg weight difference, between the bikes, when most need to be more concerned with trimming more than just a few kg's off their gut. Me included... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perce Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Aye, just stop eating pies for the winter, it'll be cheaper on two counts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widrace Posted November 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 (edited) Aye, just stop eating pies for the winter, it'll be cheaper on two counts. Darn..I like my pie! Actually, the bike is 10 lbs (4.5kg) heavier than me as it is - and that's with my gear on. Edited November 12, 2010 by widrace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 one question? what are you trying to achieve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mud400 Posted November 18, 2010 Report Share Posted November 18, 2010 >montesa stuff and pics< This one is not going to help my bank account..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan williams Posted November 20, 2010 Report Share Posted November 20, 2010 "Guys...I'm not going to do stupid s**t and spend a bunch of money" Oh yeah you are. Something I heartily endorse. Especially if you've got a bunch of Ti goodies lying around. Sorry to seem a cumudgeon but when it's unknown whether you're an experianced guy or some young'un planning on spending his tuition money "making a factory bike" I react on the side of caution. By all means have at it but do post the results. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widrace Posted November 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2010 Sorry to seem a cumudgeon but when it's unknown whether you're an experianced guy or some young'un planning on spending his tuition money "making a factory bike" I react on the side of caution. Let's see now... wrong side of 50-something, semi-retired, with residual body damage from years of motocross and enduros. Sportsman is a real bitch on that last loop and I'm just not willing to give it up yet. Said another way: Old, broke, broken and eats ibuprofen for breakfast. Back to the task at hand... I've had lots of folks look at the bike lately and solicited suggestions just to hear all kinds of ideas - AND THAT"S ALL!!! For grins, the rules were anything goes. Thought it may be entertaining (and dangerous) to share some of them here. Got any more? The tank isn't mentioned because it already has the flat 'subira' job. So far (in no particular order): X-lite tires. Tapered aluminum bars. Lightweight chain. Aluminum pegs. Remove metal from supports like front frame lowers/rear silencer/etc. Buy TI bolt kits. Yeah, sure, I'll get right on that... Sandblast half the airbox thickness away. Remove 1st, 4th, 5th gears, forks, etc. Remove metal from the upper frame pair where FEA study indicates. Extrude-hone the hollows of the upper frame and swingarm. Chemically mill the frame and swingarm hollows. Remove most of the structure from the upper frame pair leaving basic form only, wrap over with pre-preg, hybrid kevlar/carbon weave, bag and bake. Turn down the fork lowers to a minimum and do the same as above. Flute the fork lowers (lengthwise) with a ball-end mill in perhaps 12 places radially. Drill/ream a 13mm hole (laterally) through the upper and lower frame weldments that the dogbone and shock are affixed to. Drill the above out even larger and sleeve with a thinwall stainless tube. Make a fixture that affixes to the rear wheel which guides a hole saw removing rib material between spokes without disassembly. Machine/fab footpeg and misc brackets from (life-cycled) BMW F1 TI connecting rods. Machine a mag shock body copy. Kevlar (ribbed) bash plate. Water jet removal of material from discs. Fabricate kick start lever of 4130 tubing. Bolts of larger sizes made from Ti/BMW head bolts - such as dogbone/shock fasteners, etc. Ti Exhaust header. No tube that large in stock however so.... Middle exhaust of Hi temp (ceramic) composite. Ti axles Plastic screws for retention of no-stress small bits like the rear brake fluid reservoir. FIRE AWAY!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel dabster Posted November 26, 2010 Report Share Posted November 26, 2010 broke you will be as when for the same money you could buy a 2011 bike, why bother you will still have a big lump of a bike which is no where near current standards and probably weight. WOFTAM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted November 26, 2010 Report Share Posted November 26, 2010 buy a gasser or sherco. then ya got lightweight. Don't say anything about durability, because if you remove all that frame material and gears and such, then it will be weakened and basically just as durable as the other two options. Unless of course you enjoy the tinkering time in the garage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widrace Posted November 27, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2010 buy a gasser or sherco. then ya got lightweight. No Beta love? Jeff S. has been talking about one. Don't say anything about durability, because if you remove all that frame material and gears and such, then it will be weakened and basically just as durable as the other two options. Not going to radically attack the frame. Why do you think pulling gears would weaken anything? Unless of course you enjoy the tinkering time in the garage. Yep. Outside of beer for the Wgasa team, the only money I'm going to spend is on new tires, bars, chain, some gaskets (perhaps) and maybe some pegs. All the other not so crazy stuff is either stocked or freely available and will be subject for discussion over refreshments at Milford Trials Team Garage and Bar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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