2005 Acu Classic Trials Championship

[mickmetcalfe]

Well, Ive just about got warm again but the Cotton will never be the same again!

Allowing for the weather and even with the knowledge that it was going to be a lot harder than the normal classic trials I ride, I just dont think it did the pre-65 class any favours at all.

I have the greatest respect for all the effort that was put into this trial and to all of the observers (particularly those who did two sections) but it does not encourage me to any more of this series.

[marky g]

I don't think the overnight rain helped (and the snow showers!) I must admit I would not have liked to have done it on a pre 65 bike

I guess the Sammy Miller rounds cater for the pre65 brigade ? I think the trial was pretty good and hats off to the South Birmingham lot, pity about the overnight rain etc..if it would have been dry it would have been spot on.

Edited February 15, 2005 by Marky G

[woody]

I must admit I would not have liked to have done it on a pre 65 bike

Don't be fooled into thinking that all Pre65 bikes are unwieldy peices of rubbish. The leading cubs that were there on Sunday are more competitve than all but the best of the twinshocks. There are also some handy lightweight B40 and C15 trickers around too, not forgetting the James and other Villiers engined specials. All of these are good enough to give all but the latest twinshocks a run for their money. They are a lot more rideable and controllable than you think. On a standard Pre65 though you would have hurt yourself - badly. This is why they all modify them........

The series is definitely creeping towards being more suitable for twinshocks now though, above trick Pre65 bikes excepted. Riders on bigger bikes are definitely in for a struggle. In one sense I'm happy with it as there is nothing other than this series in the UK that provides challenging sections to allow riders a good competitive run out on their twinshocks. Ease the sections off and you take away the challenge and any sort of prestige that a National championship should have. Pre65 on the other hand has the Sammy Miller series, Northern Pre65 championship, Talmag, Eastern Thumpers, Scottish 2 day, another new 2 day trial this year in Scotland. The Midlands has its own Pre65 championship organised by the BMCA and I have just learned of another new Pre65 2 day road based trial to be held around Welshpool in early July. Only one of these events allows twinshocks (Spanish Pre76 only) and that is the Sammy Miller series. The rest ban twinshocks without exception.

So we need the ACU Classic to pitch the sections at the right level to offer the twinshocks a good challenge, and after a few dodgy years I think it has begun to do this. If that decreases the amount of Pre65 entries then that is sad but they are well catered for in the other events.

Personally, I would love to see the series return to the old format it began with, catering for Pre65 unit and pre-unit and twinshocks by using 2 routes. It was interesting to see the huge variety of machinery ridden and meant that groups of mates who were passionate about bikes from different eras could travel around the country and ride some truly excellent events. The change I would make from before though is to run an expert class on the hard route for the twinshocks and better riders on the trick Pre65 bikes who wish to tackle it and run a clubman class on the easier route to cater for both twinshock and Pre65 riders who don't feel capable of tackling the harder course. There would be an Experet and a Clubman champion at the end of the year in each category.

Adopting that format would cater for all abililties and may also encourage more early twinshocks to get out there as well. At the moment, 70s twinshocks are poorly represented, Fantics, Hondas and Majesties etc. being more common. My '75 Ossa is generally the oldest bike competing and it is very much outclassed by these more modern bikes which steer better and offer brake and clutch control, more power and a choice of gears other than bottom..... mmmm nice. I lost a lot of marks at the Mansell purely because I had no control downhill and no way of making tight turns on clutch and brakes. I've no complaints about this as I know the limitations of the bike in certain conditions and I ride it because I have an affinity with the marque. However, in order to be competitve a change of bike may be necessary. Tough choice for me. It is maybe issues like this that stop others from trying to compete on the older bikes. Having an easier course or even a Pre77 class in the twinshocks may encourage more people to have a go on thier older bikes as they are at least competing against equal machinery. They are out there as enough of them are selling on evil-bay.

Getting back to the Mansell, I thought it was a good trial. Only a handful of sections were 'ambitious' but the organisers were well and truly caught out with the change in weather and there was nothing they could do to alter them.

Roll on round 2 in Newquay, Cornwall. A new trial for this year. Hopefully the snow will hold off for this one. Wonder if there will be any beach sections..

[marky g]

Don't be fooled into thinking that all Pre65 bikes are unwieldy peices of rubbish.

Woody, I didn't say pre 65 bikes were rubbish at all

I said I just wouldn't fancy riding one in the Mansell

Like I said there is the Sammy Miller rounds for the pre65 boys, sections set to suit the bikes etc etc.

I think South Birmingham run a miller round toward the end of the year, and I think Steve Goode is behind the Welshpool 2day.

Edited February 16, 2005 by Andy

[woody]

Woody, I didn't say pre 65 bikes were rubbish at all 

I said I just wouldn't fancy riding one in the Mansell  

No, didn't mean that at all Mark, that bit obviously came accross wrong

Just meant that if you've never ridden one of these tricked up Pre65 machines you wouldn't believe how competitve they actually are. Quite capable of trouncing bog standard 70s twinshocks like yours and mine. The Miller series is too easy for them, or rather the bikes are too capable for the sections.

Now a standard Pre65 bike on the other hand, well, I agree with you. Definitely would not want to ride one of those around that trial. I had a standard trials B40 once. If I'd been on that on Sunday I'd be on crutches now.......

[mickmetcalfe]

Maybe Sunday wasnt the best day to judge the series, but...

What I was trying to say in my own dim witted manor was that there seems to be a massive step between the Miller and BMCA series up to this ACU classic champs. There isnt anything in between.

I love the Miller series but it is slowly but surely fading away as both the bikes and more senior riders get older couple with the relative lack of newcomers. And it can be rigthly critisised for being too easy at times. The BMCA is highly competetive but doesnt run road trials. Im looking to move on to another road based series but dont have the time or inclination to modify my painfully standard Cotton. I could by a Fantic twin shock which would make things easier or switch to the over 40s on modern bikes (which my sponsor says SHE will never allow!!)

Sunday was a good run round, despite the weather but I would say when Martin Wilmore loses 70+ marks, Scott Dommett 80+ marks and Neil Gaunt 110+. the trial is too hard for ANY pre-65 bike.

I hate to moan when it is clear the club put in a lot of effort but it is a long time since I felt so frustrated, disappointed and disillusioned with a trial. It hasnt helped that I did more damage to my bike than in any trial for a long, long time. Water is so unforgiving when placed between a piston and cylinder head!

[woody]

I wouldn't disagree with you on those points Mick.The weather certainly screwed things and although a few sections would still have been a bit 'interesting' for less capable bikes, if the weather hadn't intervened scores would have been a lot lower.

The next round in Newquay is new so no-one knows what to expect. Just hope I'm not going to travel 250 miles or whatever for 'Miller' standard sections. Bootle is worth the trip as although hard, the sections are more natural as most are up rock streams, difficult but won't pulverise the bike. Not on the road but a good ride around the fells/moors. Welsh Trophy is also good and road-based and not hard on the bikes but on a Saturday not Sunday.

I agree that there is now a fair step up from the Miller to the Classic series. This I think, is where dual routes in the Classic would come in as a clubman route would bridge that gap and encourage more riders out to play on older, more standard bikes.

Has to be something wrong somewhere with these serioes though in terms of the number of Pre65 and twinshock entries. I did the Greensmith Miller round last year to get me riding again after a long lay-off. The largest class was trail bikes, not trials bikes. In the classic series, twinshocks and Pre65 are outnumbered by Modern and air-cooled monos. Seems the very bikes the series were created for are now in the minority. Now if you go back 10 years to the old sebac/falcon series - 2 routes and generally 100+ entreis of Pre65 and twinshocks only....

[vinnied]

Sunday was a good run round, despite the weather but I would say when Martin Wilmore loses 70+ marks, Scott Dommett 80+ marks and Neil Gaunt 110+. the trial is too hard for pre-65 bike.

They are unbelievable marks for Pre65 Mick

Vinnie

[nigel dabster]

Inevitably there is a conflict of abilities here both bikes and riders. Tim Blackmore looses 19 he is a little over 40 an excellent rider, if not centre champ then nearly was, been an expert for many years on a new Scorpa sy, and riding the same sections Mick Metcalf on an old cotton, time someone had a serious look at what can never be all things to all riders. I have given up on this series because the trilas more than any other factor were generally not that enjoyable.

[t-shock 250]

I think Woody got it spot on, there should be 2 routes, one for modern twinshock / experts and another for pre-65 and older twinshock machines.

Modern bikes have no place in the classic series in my opinion (air cooled mono's are probably OK if only to boost numbers)

I think interest in this series is definately on the increase, it only takes a couple of riders in a club to get into twinshocks and before you know it there is suddenly a whole group riding them.

[mickmetcalfe]

I

[marky g]

The next round in Newquay is new so no-one knows what to expect. Just hope I'm not going to travel 250 miles or whatever for 'Miller' standard sections. Bootle is worth the trip as although hard, the sections are more natural as most are up rock streams, difficult but won't pulverise the bike. Not on the road but a good ride around the fells/moors. Welsh Trophy is also good and road-based and not hard on the bikes but on a Saturday not Sunday.

Can't make Newquay, but my mate was sending our regs off for Bootle last Monday, I've heard it was on the hard side last year (not done the trial before )

The Welsh trophy I did do last year, and enjoyed and hopefully I'll be doing again this year.

First trial on my ty175 and it showed even the engine came loose by the end of the trial, lost me front brake mounting pin with the vibration

See you guys at Bootle, come over and say hello.

[jordi]

OK, So it is the new round in Cornwall next. Can anyone tell us how far from Newquay the start is? also what kind of sections to expect?

Hope the weather is better than the Mansell.

Edited February 19, 2005 by jordi

[nigel dabster]

Is it a sidecar round, if so don't hold your breathe for quality sections.

[t-shock 250]

That's true, combined sidecar rounds are a waste of time for competitive solo riders.