bdmc Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 How many clubs allow riders to compete without a licence NSC - 7.11 PRODUCTION OF COMPETITION LICENCE OR TRIALS REGISTRATION 1. All Entrants, Riders or Passengers shall carry their current Competition Licence or Trials Registration and must be prepared to produce either document when signing on at a meeting. 2. Any Rider or Passenger in possession of a current Competition Licence or Trials Registration but unable to produce it when signing on will be permitted to take part in the meeting but will be subject to a i ne, payable to the ACU Benevolent Fund. h e amount of the i ne will be found listed in the current edition of the ACU Handbook under Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 How many clubs allow riders to compete without a licence NSC - 7.11 PRODUCTION OF COMPETITION LICENCE OR TRIALS REGISTRATION 1. All Entrants, Riders or Passengers shall carry their current Competition Licence or Trials Registration and must be prepared to produce either document when signing on at a meeting. 2. Any Rider or Passenger in possession of a current Competition Licence or Trials Registration but unable to produce it when signing on will be permitted to take part in the meeting but will be subject to a i ne, payable to the ACU Benevolent Fund. h e amount of the i ne will be found listed in the current edition of the ACU Handbook under Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted August 20, 2011 Report Share Posted August 20, 2011 Is this for real? Is this a wind up? I can see Clubs closing overnight! Who in their right mind would run a club with this hanging over them? Are they seriously expecting riders to pay a fine because they left their license at home even though you've seen it at every other event this year? And what about encouraging new riders? we had a beginners and wobblers trial recently in our centre and no one could ride without a licence? two of my mates fancied a go but it would take at least 3 weeks to get a licence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02-apr Posted August 21, 2011 Report Share Posted August 21, 2011 (edited) Like it or not the fact of the matter is that if one of your unlicenced wobblers wobbles in to a "spectator"/parked car etc (who may or may not have anything to do with the event) the insurance company will step swiftly backwards leaving the Club liable. If they were to indemnify the competitor they would recover sums involved - step forward Mr Club Secretary, your house is first to go! Edited August 21, 2011 by 2/4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdmc Posted August 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2011 Not a wind up. See your AUC Handbook. All CoC should know this!!!!! Regarding waiting 3 weeks!!! you can affiliate on the day if you fill in the form and pay your Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 2/4 makes very valid and legal points above, OTF, you are actually well off the mark, yes I know you don't like the ACU or Scotland, that is evident from your previous posts, you are of course entitled to your opinion, but...! It has been long debated by the ACU/SACU/MCUI with their insurance providers and advisers that clerk of courses and secretaries have a duty to check the ID of riders, its all in the ACU handbook and has been for years. Heaven forbid if a non-licenced bloke turns up just for a bit of fun, says he is someone else, but hasn't brought his licence, is allowed to ride and then (God forbid this never happens) runs into and kills someone, perhaps a small child who was spectating, think of the sports' reputational risk and seriously the court action and law suit that would most certainly follow. It just doesn't bare thinking about, and if you don't think that would ever happen, don't be too sure. I personally have seen photographic evidence of this in the last 18 months, but I certainly won't go into detail on an open website! And if you think I'm just being my usual kidding self, can I just mention one famous persons' case that is still ongoing, sure the bloke was a great driver, he actually started off in Scottish youth in trials - Colin Macrae, look what has happened there! That case is still ongoing. He took off just for a short trip in a helicopter with a friend, his own son and a school pal of his son, Colin was a very accomplished pilot, now the pursuers agents are claiming his paperwork wasn't in order, that included his flying licence. Just a thought...? (Sorry if this looks as if its from a Scots perspective, but the principles apply throughout the land) Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totalshell Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 i dont think there is any argument that the correct licence was not held at the time BG. the issue of never been asked to produce a licence always baffles me. in car rallying you have to have your licence and the cars licence no licence no drive simples and yet in trials with 5k bikes we cant show a 10 quid card cos it costs too much.. lazy and incompetant riders would soon get the idea if clubs did ask for your licence its a tenner BG will no doubt relate thst its much more oop north and in spain its more by several hundreds.. you bet they sjhow theres>> get em out lads.. one club local to us lost a piece of land this year when someone put thier foot in a rabbit hole and bypassed the club and the farmer and went straight to the titled person that owns the land.. end of trials use of land.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Totalshell, I remember riding in the 1978 Alan trophy Trial near Carlisle on a 325 Bultaco, I'm almost certain it was some form of championship event, anyway all the top riders were there, I queued up behind: Martin Lampkin; Derrick Edmondson; Nigel Birkett; Malcolm Rathmell and a few more, I was in very distinguished company in that orderly queue. Without a word spoken EVERY ONE of them produced their ACU licence, the secretary of the meeting did not ask any of them to "show me your licence" they did it automatically. Now then, if it was good enough for those top rate guys back then, then why are Joe Bloggs and Co not keen to "flash the card" now? Just try not showing your licence to Highland Lassie at teh Scottish Six Days Trial, you will be told to go home, no licence no ride! They will not take any risks and they don't know everyone who enters! Rules are rarely made just for a bit of something to do, like petty officialdom. Believe me the ACU card and SACU licence are identification medium to protect your club officials, who do everything for FREE and could loose the shirt of their back because of mindless numbnuts who should grow up and act like sensible human beings and stop whinging! Big John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monty_jon Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 (edited) Well said Big John, I did MX for 20+ years and never once forgot my licence! Edited August 27, 2011 by Monty_Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 (edited) 2/4 makes very valid and legal points above, OTF, you are actually well off the mark, yes I know you don't like the ACU or Scotland, that is evident from your previous posts, you are of course entitled to your opinion, but...! It has been long debated by the ACU/SACU/MCUI with their insurance providers and advisers that clerk of courses and secretaries have a duty to check the ID of riders, its all in the ACU handbook and has been for years. Heaven forbid if a non-licenced bloke turns up just for a bit of fun, says he is someone else, but hasn't brought his licence, is allowed to ride and then (God forbid this never happens) runs into and kills someone, perhaps a small child who was spectating, think of the sports' reputational risk and seriously the court action and law suit that would most certainly follow. It just doesn't bare thinking about, and if you don't think that would ever happen, don't be too sure. I personally have seen photographic evidence of this in the last 18 months, but I certainly won't go into detail on an open website! And if you think I'm just being my usual kidding self, can I just mention one famous persons' case that is still ongoing, sure the bloke was a great driver, he actually started off in Scottish youth in trials - Colin Macrae, look what has happened there! That case is still ongoing. He took off just for a short trip in a helicopter with a friend, his own son and a school pal of his son, Colin was a very accomplished pilot, now the pursuers agents are claiming his paperwork wasn't in order, that included his flying licence. Just a thought...? (Sorry if this looks as if its from a Scots perspective, but the principles apply throughout the land) Big John Firstly BJ i have no problem with Scotland love the place actually but i dont profess to worship at the holy grail of the Scottish "pre65" two day or think the sun comes out every time the suits at the ACU bend over. I also agree with most though not ALL of the comments made. My perspective is from the point of trying to keep a club going that is pretty close to going under due to lack of entries and the overwhelming amount of red tape being deposited from a great height by the dons at the governing body. The ACU seem to want to use a very broad brush in applying rules and regulations that may be essential in other branches of the sport that they control by may be of dubious importance at a Club trial which is ALL i am concerned with. The other point i would like to make although i am sure i will get flammed by the previous posters for it is why can i ride at events organised by local clubs who are affiliated to the AMCA where a licence is not even required and NOBODY gets this amount of hassle god forbid a fine!!. They actually get this even welcome new riders now that makes a change? Lets not forget according the the rule book if a potential new rider turns up i am first supposed to get him to fill in a licence application form and donate Edited August 27, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon v8 Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Why do the ACU insist on calling it a licence anyway ? Its not,its a membership card with yer photo on it.There is no proof of any basic standard of riding ability or proof of health etc - so what is it for ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabby Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 yet i have to write cheques after each trial to the ACU for nearly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 OTF, stop trying to blame other people for your own club's failures and shortcomings, I don't prescribe to the let's pass the buck malarky! I think you should look inward if your club has a problem? That's like a businessman who has had a long line of loss making years' pointing a finger at his bank manager and saying, "its your fault you pulled my overdraft out from underneath me and I have now filled for bankrupcy". Was it all the banks' fault? - really? You honestly believe that it's the ACU's fault that a club fails? - really? No, there are always mitigating factors, loss of land, change of committee members and direction, rider's preferences changes, standard of riding going up or going down; new people wanting to do things differently etc... etc... etc... etc...zzzzzzzzzz! We all know about the "recession", but you seem to moan about a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 (edited) OTF, stop trying to blame other people for your own club's failures and shortcomings, I don't prescribe to the let's pass the buck malarky! I think you should look inward if your club has a problem? That's like a businessman who has had a long line of loss making years' pointing a finger at his bank manager and saying, "its your fault you pulled my overdraft out from underneath me and I have now filled for bankrupcy". Was it all the banks' fault? - really? You honestly believe that it's the ACU's fault that a club fails? - really? No, there are always mitigating factors, loss of land, change of committee members and direction, rider's preferences changes, standard of riding going up or going down; new people wanting to do things differently etc... etc... etc... etc...zzzzzzzzzz! We all know about the "recession", but you seem to moan about a Edited August 27, 2011 by Old trials fanatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon v8 Posted August 28, 2011 Report Share Posted August 28, 2011 Come on chaps,there is no point in falling out over this - its an interesting topic and one that needs discussing. Like I said I cant really see the point of an ACU licence as it does not prove anything about the rider.If the ACU are worried about losing money why dont they just drop them altogether and include the funding in entry fees as the AMCA do.That way nobody can cop out of paying,when I send the permit form and cheque back to the AMCA after every trial its easy to see that everyone has paid their dues.It also must cost alot of money to print the licences and administer them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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