copemech Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 There are those "Old Boys" that seem to have a torque wrench fitted inside their wrist. and can actually get the torque within a couple ft/lbs of what it needs to be. Zipper, you hit it! For me, operating an air ratchet feels as normal to me as jerking off does to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Yeah I've decided I'm going to remove the basket with an impact gun, and ill just tighten with a ratchet until its tight enough. Now with the new clutch basket, I'll need to rivet the gear assembly on to it. Do any of you guys have experience with this and have any tips? or is it just standard thanks for the help Laddie, we are trying to help here, yet the more I read from you makes me wonder if you should attempt this. You seem unprepared and have not absorbed the help already given. Again, the clutch basket replacement procedure is in a video on the Splatshop website, go find it and watch it to decide if you are prepared. Even with Chris at the helm of this, I personally might do it a bit differently as once again, I have tools such as PROPER air riviting drivers, yet that is another story. Another thing, if you think you will bring the nut up to proper torque going back with a standard hand ratchet and no holder to 60 nm you may be in for a bit of surprise! You would be better advised to etch or mark the nut and shaft with something like an engraving tool prior to disassembly so you can go back to original marks at least or slightly beyond and hope there is little to no varience in the new part. If one gets ham fisted on this nut and takes out the threads on that shaft, you are screwed! Something for you to sleep on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 never used a torque wrench in 30 years of working on bikes. Still waiting for the first problem.... Grib and Glenn, I was very near making a quote on this issue in my prior post such as "There are really only two ways to do this "! I intentionally refrained due to the debate you two brought up. As example for grib. Time is money in my business. Fact is with proper tools I could concieveably shag that clutch out in under 5 min. Just how good is that wrench you have, lad? When was the last time it was tested and certified best of 5% accurate? May be one them Chineese imports for a tenner? Mind you, even as I say all that, I do doo most things by hand when not hurried. Feck knows Baldilocks is nothing better than a roadside hack job waiting to happen! Hell man, I have an electric gun that rips wheel nuts off cars and back! One has to be careful with this crap, it would shread that clutch nut! On the same token, I have an old Snapon 3/8 drive air pistol I thought I would use last time when I put crank seals in the "07. I t sounds good and works, but it would not drive that crank nut back to the orig mark at 100 nm! Feck me, I had to get the big gun and go gently! All just examples, so heed accordingly! Add another half to you lads vast experience and put it into application on a daily basis while applied to a mass of cars bikes and HD trucks and you get better perspective, you know! Just saying. Keep up the good work lads! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 (edited) Ok by way of explanation impact gun for removal and re fit of clutch, primary gear and flywheel nut. mark it before you remove if you like but the gun i have only just manages to get these things off so goes back as tight as i can get it. everything else i use a spanner and experience ! Edited January 25, 2013 by baldilocks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grib Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 As example for grib. Time is money in my business. Fact is with proper tools I could concieveably shag that clutch out in under 5 min. Just how good is that wrench you have, lad? When was the last time it was tested and certified best of 5% accurate? May be one them Chineese imports for a tenner? Time is money?? - This is a guy working on his own bike at home..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted January 25, 2013 Report Share Posted January 25, 2013 Zipper, you hit it! For me, operating an air ratchet feels as normal to me as jerking off does to you! I don't need an air compressor for me to get off!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Ok by way of explanation impact gun for removal and re fit of clutch, primary gear and flywheel nut. mark it before you remove if you like but the gun i have only just manages to get these things off so goes back as tight as i can get it. everything else i use a spanner and experience ! You see! At least he admits it! Put the thing back proper you hack! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Time is money?? - This is a guy working on his own bike at home..... Granted, yet you asked what advantage. Even messing with this stuff at home I admit I mostly doo by hand, yet in instances such as this the big iron comes out, and I am not waiting on special tools and gear. Going back without referance points is certainly not the desireable option, thus the markings prior to disassembly. Trust me, I use plenty o torque wrenches in critical applications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham2 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 You see! At least he admits it! Put the thing back proper you hack! A bit of background here Mark; his family were Honda dealers for a long time, he does have a lot more experience than your average trials geezer. You know what it's like when you become familiar with the spanners and you have the 'touch'. Talking of the 'touch' my apprenticeship was in heavy duty industrial hydraulics many years ago and bolting that pressure in safely was paramount. Some of the old fellas could nip up a bolt 'to spec' more accurately than a freshly calibrated torque wrench, for a laugh they would add the tut (think Skippy the bush kangaroo ) when they were done. Even though they were bang on the money they received official repremands for not taking the torque wrench out of its packaging!! So the moral of the story is? If you have the right tool, use it...if you haven't...er...don't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b40rt Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 So when skippy went tut tut tut, he was really saying 34 lbs/ft, not two men with guns shooting roo's. I dont think so ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dombush Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Because we use lots of small fasteners (M2.5, M3 etc) into a variety of materials it's critical that we dont under or overdo it. When we get a new member of staff we test them for their "feel" of the correct torque. We then check the actual torque with a calibrated wrench. As a bit of fun the whole team always joins in and the experienced guys are remarkably accurate (usually within 10% on the regular sizes). Its always great to see that the apprentices get to +/- 15% quite quickly (a couple of months). At this point we dont mandate a torque wrench except for safety critical stuff (like ham2's boilers) Dom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 thanks for the praise ham Theres a couple more points to think about here First of all Copey is right to point out, although he perhaps didnt mean to, that compressors, impact guns, spanners all come in different sizes. So what i should have said is if your using my gear you wont have a problem with overtightening with an impact gun as the gun at is maximum is only just strong enough to remove the nut which presumably was set at the correct torque at the factory. Also only use it on the areas I use it on and not on say a 6mm bolt in alloy. second thing is I'm a desk jockey sitting at a keyboard Monday to Friday and in my experience I havent ever had the strength to snap or strip a bolt using a ring spanner. Not everybody has my lack of strength or spanner set ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldilocks Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 (edited) Just looked at Copeys torque values which are pinned Never used a torque wrench, i have seen one before but it only worked with a socket. So unless there is a ring spanner version how do you torque cylinder base nuts as I can't get a socket on the front two ? Edited January 26, 2013 by baldilocks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham2 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 (edited) So when skippy went tut tut tut, he was really saying 34 lbs/ft, not two men with guns shooting roo's. I dont think so ! Here's a bit of assistance for Copey just incase he's never seen Skippy before: He torques at about 10 seconds in...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEVusbPcTmg Just looked at Copeys torque values which are pinned Never used a torque wrench, i have seen one before but it only worked with a socket. So unless there is a ring spanner version how do you torque cylinder base nuts as I can't get a socket on the front two ? Here's another tool I don't use , I think there's a ring-spanner stub as well. Edited January 26, 2013 by ham2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copemech Posted January 27, 2013 Report Share Posted January 27, 2013 Lots of good points made here on the topic to which I originally declined to open the can o'worms! You see the entire topic is rather vague because even in many if not most cases the folks that put out the specs did not specify dry thread or lubed thread and such. There are variables and then there are basic charts published for applications such as putting a certain size bolt of given hardness in a given substance such as ally or steel and it can vary quite a bit. There are certain bolts that are high stress and we take them to the limits of the metals elasticity by stretching them, and are one time use. They do make special torque wrenches for many production applications that only the factorys have! Or in a case of critical application, one must know how to do the math for a specific offset on a tool such as Ham has shown. As Dom states, this all becomes more critical in general with the small sizes, and feel it where it is at. Seems obvious I have given Baldi a bit of stick here intentionally as a joke, but I am sure he has a decent grasp of things. Only caution perhaps would be on them flywheel nuts in a trials application, as you may not want to risk one on the loose side of things! The origanal poster is prolly baffled by all this bs, but oh well, get a grip or let someone do it that has one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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