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nickday1

Trial GP - the good, the bad and the ugly

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Great trial on Sunday and as ever some unbelievable skills on display.

Few thoughts and questions on the event from discussions there and thoughts after

Good:
Good Venue 
Very easy to get to all sections
Well organised (to a point - see below) and well set up operation

Bad:
Saturday was spent primarily crowded around only the qualifying section as there was literally nothing else doing (after practice)
I like the idea of qualifying and enjoyed it on Saturday but having the whole afternoon around it and that one section seems such a waste
Still some huge huge inconsistencies in observing with 1 rider getting a 5 and another getting a 0 for identical rides but that's the never ending stop/no stop discussion that I wont rekindle here (although lets be honest they all stop) ... and some ludicrous marking.

Ugly:
No trade stands at all other than importers showing bikes (and seemingly paying ludicrous amounts to do so) who I can only imagine had been told they couldn't sell any clothing etc for some stupid reason.
Cost : * Event entry fine - happy to pay. 
           * £5 a day to park in a field is a bit much.
           * As I walked in on Saturday 'would you like a programme'  'brilliant' I think 'that's £5 please' £5 for a decent programme no problems but it was literally a load of poorly produced sh*t with paid for adverts and event info (that was already up on site or on the app) 
           * Rip off food / drink wagon and ice cream trucks (who were able to put prices up over the weekend willy nilly - presumably because they had also paid an extortionate amount to be there) 

General view is that we cant help but feel we're just being used to help fund retirement funds for some who proclaim to be in it for the sport not the money.

 

Questions:
1: why are these events only 1 day now and not 2 day anymore? Japan is 2 day - seemingly only because it's a long way to go... But surely the expense for the factories / riders etc stays largely the same whether 1 or 2 day
Is there a reason for this?? 2 day (to me and those I spoke to) makes so much more sense and make a better weekend all round. The 2 day events were always so good and make the journey / expense that much more worthwhile.
Always loved a Friday at world rounds. Fewer spectators there and much more relaxed, chatty riders and practice sessions etc.
Why can't they practice and qualify Friday, compete Saturday and use Saturdays finish positions for Sundays starting order?

2: If staying only 1 day (for whatever the reasoning) why not let the Trial GP women and Trial 2 women (or Trial 125 if at event) ride on the Saturday? 
I (along with the majority of the crowd) was watching mainly the trial GP riders - with some overlap on lap 2 to see some Trial GP women and Trial 2 riders
To me, having the women riders ride on a Saturday gives them a much higher visibility to the spectators and allows them to showcase their talents to more people and makes Saturday a better day for everyone.

3: (not a question but an observation) observing - surely the only way to get consistency is to get a team of professional Trial GP observers who observe at all the rounds. 
Appreciate this adds additional cost to whole set up but at least that way there would be a consistent understanding and application of the rules. worthwhile? Doable or not do we think?


All in all the whole Trial GP offering is good, very positive, uniformed and professional and much better than it used to be. Sunday was a great day but Saturday and the 'trade' area just felt flat and seemed largely lacking in anything.

The whole social media work they do is great - and given that qualifying is shown online I possibly wouldn't bother going next year on the Saturday but just get up and out early Sunday.
The team seem very dedicated and hardworking. Am sure this is still being polished and a 'work in progress' so changes will come with time.

Just my musings, interested to see what others feel and if people know answers to questions

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With regard to the parking, this was mentioned a few times and the price was down to the farmer, not the organisers. Not a lot of choice except to accept what he wanted to charge as there was nowhere else.

I noticed the rip-off food fluctuating prices too. £4.00 for a roll and sausage on Saturday morning which jumped to £5.00 at lunchtime. Sunday I spotted the legend Mick Wren with a sausage and bacon roll and thought "ooh, I fancy one of them" till they tried to charge me £8.00 for it. Told them they could do one at that price and it suddenly came down to £5.00.

I was skeptical (though not vocal about it) about the ability of Addingham to host a large event like that, but it worked. Enjoyed the weekend though I've been there before when it's been pissing down and blowing a gale and it would have been a different story had we not been lucky with the weather.

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I enjoyed the event, I also was disappointed at the lack of goodies to buy. Didn't notice the prices fluctuating but would have been annoyed if I had. Loved the craic and friendly atmosphere though.

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Nicday is effectively repeating the article I wrote at the end of last year in a well known publication (no problem with that), and I continue to echo his views. Unfortunately, due to previous commitments I was unable to attend this year, but wish I had as it would have been infinitely preferable my experiences that weekend. 

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I didn’t go but I followed it all live Saturday and Sunday which I think is fantastic , again I can’t say much because I wasn’t there but it looked like the same section repeated 15 times.i truly believe the best venue that they could possibly use in this country is ..hawkstone park! The atmosphere at the world rounds there in 05-08 has never been beaten for me .and in no stop format I think it would be amazing 

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Agree with hgas Hawkstone Park was an awesome venue...believe their monetary demands are the reason we haven't been there for some time.

Addingham was head and shoulders above Tong. Great sections easily accessible If perhaps a touch on the easy side, that being said one rain shower would have doubled the numbers no doubt.

Food prices ridiculous but what we're they charged to be there.....

Would have been great to see all the importers present lots of stands and gear for sale etc.....I heard a rumour of £700 per day for a stand to be present...completely third hand and could be total rubbish.

Would love to see it back there next year with a few tweaks in place

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13 hours ago, hillary said:

Nicday is effectively repeating the article I wrote at the end of last year in a well known publication (no problem with that), and I continue to echo his views. Unfortunately, due to previous commitments I was unable to attend this year, but wish I had as it would have been infinitely preferable my experiences that weekend. 

Oh.. sorry I did not see that :(

But like I said my views were pretty much mirrored by everyone I spoke with or conversations going on around me.

I also loved hawkstone in the good old days.. Assume cost prohibitive maybe (cant make as much profit if Hawkstone costs more I guess!)

With regards to the 1 day 2 day questions. Does anyone know why this is?? Andy maybe? 

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I don't have the answer, I'm afraid. At one point it was the factories who didn't want two day competitions, but I don't know if that's still the case. I don't think the qualification part is going away so two days of competition would mean having to move qualification to the Friday with few spectators.

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3 hours ago, Andy said:

I don't have the answer, I'm afraid. At one point it was the factories who didn't want two day competitions, but I don't know if that's still the case. I don't think the qualification part is going away so two days of competition would mean having to move qualification to the Friday with few spectators.

Oh OK, I did wonder if it was maybe driven by the factories. Sure there is extra cost involved but if you're there anyway, let the boys and girls ride.. They do Japan, so what's the difference in Europe etc?
Poss way to get more spectators there on a Friday - qualifying ladies / ladies 2, trial day 1: ladies / ladies 2 and qualifying GP / trial 2

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Try paying $22 (£20 ish) dollars to park in disney land then youll know what being ripped off is.

Agree 2 days agree trade stands. Prfessional observers are fine, but what natioanality? Hotel for 3 nights minimum and board and lodgings at each round would add alot more than you think?

 

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Ha I know what you mean re: parking in other places and extortionate costs but I'd imagine (unless particularly savvy or greedy) the farmer would have said yes I want £xx for the 3 days. rather than I want £5 per car per day.
Also imagine Disney car parks require a bit more upkeep.

Re: 2 days, be interesting to know reasons/costings behind factories wanting only 1 day. I guess ultimately the outcome/results would be largely the same for an additional expense but from a spectator / putting on an event point of view its loads better

Re: observers, yes would cost a fair chunk more with flights etc etc etc so would solve a problem but also create a (cost) problem. Nationality wise, does it matter? Assume UK like (I think) everyone else involved in Trial GP would be fine. All the riders pretty much speak amazing English or at least enough to ask 'why 5' :D
 

As with most things there's no easy (cheap) solution but there is a solution

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WTC is so far away from real everyday Trials these days it's almost like a different sport . Rules are unenforceable and don't work , which makes the whole thing a farce .Must be a nightmare unless you're Spanish ......

 

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14 minutes ago, motorcycleemptyness said:

Rules are unenforceable and don't work, which makes the whole thing a farce.

 

If you're referring to the no-stop rule, I have to reluctantly agree. I would love no-stop to work but there is too much of a grey area, so that's not practical. But neither is the current situation. Watching the video of the UK Trial GP, a couple of people were given 5s for very minor hesitations, while others got away with longer pauses. We can't just drop the rule because we'll then go back to the same situation that brought the rule in in the first place (well, second place, if you're old enough). Perhaps there is a middle ground: as soon as a bike has clearly stopped, the observer gives a countdown "Three, two, one, fail!".

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My question would be does Trials need Championships and that's at every level from club to WTC.

Three most popular trials in the UK are the Scott the SSDT and the Reeth 3 three day don't do championships.

We've about 200 members and try getting a decent turnout at  a presentation hopeless, also the club up here that gets the best entries for it's club trials has no awards.

The average Trials rider has little interest in these things they just want a fun day on the bike.

 

 

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The point you're missing is the 3 day, the scott and the ssdt are all fiercly competitive and whether its in a championship or not the same top riders will always want to COMPETE.

A WTC is important to be the pinnacle of our sport and give the upcoming youth something to aim for, and to believe that when they win, as many British riders have, they are the best in the world.

Good luck to Toby Martin btw in Italy next week.

I would say the absolute opposite that most trials riders do take an interest, albeit a take it or leave it attitude, they will look at results etc.

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