stu Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 nice ,that was nice................Paloli I think you should br doin this column................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toofasttim Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 one scramble That scramble must have Been a cracker. Forty years bloody off-road experience and ONE scramble? Probably got the same opinion of MX as I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenchie Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 No Rappers you should n t get a ride......... I maintain this trial should be for people who week in and out ride pre 65 trials. Previous posts regarding Machine eligibility notably Woodys sum up my feeling also, and are spot on. Nobody save the organising club knows how their ballot works but looking at the entry list it seems quite a few of the same names continue to either dodge the ballot or possiibly never go into the hat. This is not a new problem and one I remember get rather peeved about almost 10 years ago when I was actively trying to get a ride . The organising club never makes a comment , or not one I have ever read on the way they run the trial and how they select entries. Possibly saying nothing says it all......... They have who they want, riding what they want... then they ballot the rest. Big John I enjoy your replies, nd I am sure like a lot of others you will enjoy continual rides at the Pre 65 scottish for as long as you want them. I look forward to same debate... around this time next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostit Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Woody is of course right Pre 65 trials is a rich mans game, deep pockets or access to machinery will gain you all the advantages you need. I don't know how seriously the point was made but I think Magnon may have something, accept that 40 year old bikes will have been re-manufactured somewhere along the way but assess eligibility against the origional all up weight of the bike, steel rims, tanks and all. Would be interesting to see how it was fiddled round. I too take a dim view of the occasional rider getting an entry, I've got an eligible machine but I don't ride Pre-65 regularly, so I don't enter although I'd love to ride the trial. Why take the ride of someone who is more committed to this branch of the sport than me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpa3 Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 ......... I maintain this trial should be for people who week in and out ride pre 65 trials. How would the organising club work this out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Big John, Simple (but no doubt contentious!) regulation that would curtail excessive bike development .... make it a condition of entry that anyone offered Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Is the real crux of the matter, the fact more people want to ride than there are places for? If all 300 entries got a ride, would there be less complaints about who is riding what? Say the event could only attract 100 entries because of strict machine requirments, would it die ? If a business had to keep turning over 100 customers away every time they opened, do you think they would come up with a way to cater for those customers ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Is the real crux of the matter, the fact more people want to ride than there are places for? If all 300 entries got a ride, would there be less complaints about who is riding what? That's about the size of it! Big John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ishy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 Double up the starting order, half the entry start at section 16, set amount of delay given to get to that point and back from 15 when they have completed the course, day two they start at section 1 and the other half of the entry start at section 16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old trials fanatic Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 (edited) How are you going to get 300 riders to complete the course without floodlights? The logistics just wont work. I understand how the people feel who have not got an entry but so far only Woodie has come up with something aproaching a logical arguement about elegibility and not just abuse. Rappers was invited to contribute a collum and i for one really enjoy his weekly contributions. I couldnt do it. They are always hought provoking and elicit comments as this one has. I think some of the posts are bordering on personal abuse and i would like to think this forum is above that sort of thing. Hopefully. Simple fact is the logistics of the event means that 180 is about the maximum number of riders that can be coped with so there will ALWAYS probably be people who are unlucky. The real arguement, apart from the elegibility one for which there is no answer unless a universal governing body applies rules that are binding at ALL levels of the sport and are policed stringently which aint ever gonna happen, is should ANY riders get an automatic entry? should riders be allowed to have more than three consecutive rides whatever the result of a ballot? Should riders get an entry just because they have entered their daughter? We all know the score. Only real answer should be an independant true ballot but the other side of the coin is the Edinburgh Club are the organising Club so they can do exactly as they feel fit. The elegibility rules will always be a hot topic but a large part of Mikes column was also about some of the riders getting an entry year on year. Perhaps we could debate and come to a conclusion on that issue? Edited January 22, 2008 by Old trials fanatic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 whats the matter big john, you answering for rappers now, No Rappers can answer for himself! Big John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big john Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 How are you going to get 300 riders to complete the course without floodlights?Only real answer should be an independant true ballot but the other side of the coin is the Edinburgh Club are the organising Club so can do exactly as they feel fit. Absolutely correct OTF, the club are limited to 180 for a very good set of reasons, two of these are the levels of payment of fees to the SRAC as the event makes use of the public road...and...the course is but 25 miles long so to take it up to around 300 like the Scottish Six Days would certainly not be practical. The observers would need to take sleeping bags and tents! The organising club of any event always has the right to return entries as they see fit. (as long as it is not on the grounds of age; gender; disability; ethnic origin; creed; colour; social status; sexual discrimination; occupation; religion;or political opinion) to be correct about it! Big John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieboy Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 How about instead of a 2 day,why not 2 separate entries.Friday and Saturday.300 entered so 150 on fri ,150 on sat. I'm sure some of the older riders drop out on the 2nd day at the moment anyway,its a tough 2 days for man and machine ,25 miles each. Same sections each day.Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greeves Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 It would be funny to know the nationalities of the 120 entries refused (although impossible to know). I bet most of them where non UK riders, at least 35 from Spain, 30 from France, Germans, Italians, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottt Posted January 22, 2008 Report Share Posted January 22, 2008 If all 300 entries got a ride, would there be less complaints about who is riding what?Say the event could only attract 100 entries because of strict machine requirments, would it die ? If a business had to keep turning over 100 customers away every time they opened, do you think they would come up with a way to cater for those customers ? If every that entered got a place the only difference would be the arguing over what bike was legible would happen after the event, "he only won because its a fiddle bike" etc Who's to say that they wouldnt get 400 entries if they made the machine requirments strict, perhaps more people with genuine bikes might be tempted to give it a go, sections made slightly easier, competing against genuine bikes etc might just tempt more genuine bike owners to enter and tempt more enthusiasts to go to watch it. Probably many reasons why they cant cater for everyone, OTF answers that one. Like the weight idea probably the most sensible idea i've heard, some would still try to change parts after the weigh in, but a simple bit of scrutineering paint on various parts would stop that to some extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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