June 15, 201313 yr plus the fact if its section design/severity wtf has pre 65 got to do with it, and why are the normandales not oversubscribed?
June 15, 201313 yr Its quite simple what has happened to modern trials - its killing itself because of mans natural aim for competition and progress.Much as I liked them as a bike,(And I rode one for a long time) the Yam mono era was when it all started to fall over.The bikes have become so good that they flatter even mediocre riders,getting them over terrain that previously they had no chance on. So then whoever is marking out the trial has to put in more and more stupidly difficult sections to take marks off riders.Very few are good enough to have a chance of doing well,plus they don't want to end up in hospital with a bent bike back in the garage.Its not about money either,even in recession you see every weekend people out doing their chosen pastime,fishing ,shooting, mountain biking etc - all can cost plenty of money if you want it to.I have absolutely NO intention of buying a modern bike,it leaves me stone cold - but I wouldn't let the cost of a bike get in the way if I did. So along comes "Classic trials",or whatever you want to call it - guess what its growing.... Wonder why ? Maybe because its friendly,non damaging and has sections that the average rider from 8 to over 80 can ride without killing themselves.As for the money side of it,well you can easily spend more than a modern bike would cost,but just as much fun can be had on a TY175 for less than a grand - so its not about money either. Sections that riders have a chance on is the answer,not restricting bike design. Just because a section is set above where your comfort level is doesn't mean you have to ride it. At least here in Colorado all of the sections we set are ride able for every member in the class with some challenge as there are some riders who have more ability than others. So either take your 5 move on to the next section or get your butt off the coach and get out there and practice till your hands fall off the bars. Now if the vintage trials is more your thing then by all means go for it there is no one requiring you to ride any single line or class. I ride the advanced line here in Colorado with a 1994 Beta Techno at 175 lbs. It currently is the oldest bike in that class and i can out ride most of the other riders in the class but for one reason i go out and practice with my heavy paper weight to make myself better. Eventually im going to buy a new bike no matter what the cost because im going to be buying a well built technology pushing machine and its going to be worth every bit of 8k to go out and beat the crap out of it because that's my enjoyment. Getting out with great friends riding in beautiful locations and enjoying the sport for what it is. Edited June 15, 201313 yr by beta_trials
June 15, 201313 yr Its quite simple what has happened to modern trials - its killing itself because of mans natural aim for competition and progress.Much as I liked them as a bike,(And I rode one for a long time) the Yam mono era was when it all started to fall over.The bikes have become so good that they flatter even mediocre riders,getting them over terrain that previously they had no chance on. So then whoever is marking out the trial has to put in more and more stupidly difficult sections to take marks off riders.Very few are good enough to have a chance of doing well,plus they don't want to end up in hospital with a bent bike back in the garage.Its not about money either,even in recession you see every weekend people out doing their chosen pastime,fishing ,shooting, mountain biking etc - all can cost plenty of money if you want it to.I have absolutely NO intention of buying a modern bike,it leaves me stone cold - but I wouldn't let the cost of a bike get in the way if I did. So along comes "Classic trials",or whatever you want to call it - guess what its growing.... Wonder why ? Maybe because its friendly,non damaging and has sections that the average rider from 8 to over 80 can ride without killing themselves.As for the money side of it,well you can easily spend more than a modern bike would cost,but just as much fun can be had on a TY175 for less than a grand - so its not about money either. Sections that riders have a chance on is the answer,not restricting bike design. EXACTLY !!!!!
June 15, 201313 yr OK,maybe I'm totally wrong,but I firmly believe that the bikes are so good that most riders cant do them credit - hence the popularity of twinshock / P65,the sections cant be too hard cos the bikes just wont go over them. Asking an observer for a 5 is no problem for a novice now and again,but the average clubman rider is soon going to lose interest with a constant stream of 3's or 5's. Taking it a stage further,with the right development the bikes could be better off without riders at all.If you don't agree you only have to look at jet fighter design,their performance is more limited by the pilot - even with G suits etc than the capabilities of the actual plane itself.Trials bikes don't get that kind of investment,but they would get a lot more if more Joe Wobblers could get around modern sections,rather than being intimidated by huge steps etc. I'm only stating what I see,the last modern trial I went to had 22 riders,my club generally gets 60-100 entries,as do the two other main clubs I ride in.Wonder what the bikes would be like if modern trials all had entries like that ?
June 15, 201313 yr I dont know where you guys get your head up the ar$e views from? I ride in the 4 or 5 centres and if you choose your trials there is always something for everyone, I cant think of the last trial i rode where there wasnt an easy course so easy I couldnt have managed with a ty80
June 15, 201313 yr Author Zippy - You are misinterpreting my post. I did not say go back to twinshocks, nor did I say bikes have to be heavy. Monoshock has a great advantage over twinshocks and 70 to 75 Kg as I suggested is pretty light.as for cable clutches suck, properly deigned cable or rod operated systems are virtually indistinguishable from hydraulic systems, after all a cable is used for the most vial part of trials riding - throttle control. I know of plenty of MX riders and several trials riders who have had to pull out of events because of breakage of hydraulic components. Because cable components are much cheaper, therefore it is easier to have spares, also cable parts are much easier to replace in the field than hydraulics. I see my topic has started to drift into a general discussion on twinshocks vs modern and section severity. Cheers Edit - Montesa (or Honda as it really is) I don't thing there were any at Richmond BTC and I don't think they are imported into UK any more. How long before Honda pull out altogether? Ossa - The most technically advanced bike - look at the depreciation , approximately twice that of gasgas, how long before this has a negative influence on prospective purchasers of new Ossas and the consequences that follow from that? Edited June 15, 201313 yr by dadof2
June 16, 201313 yr Who wants to keep smashing £5000 on a pile of rocks for a plastic trophy, i do i do. the problem with the sport is what makes the sport great to us. it's not racing, it's not in a stadium where they can sit watch and order beer while a screaming announcer builds intensity and we see riders jump high in the air, or go 200 mph for 5 hours. trials is not a sport for the majority, it's slow, it's in the woods, it takes a long hike to see riders in the sections instead of the riders performing right in front of my comfy seat, while they eat over priced hot dogs drinking over priced beer. stadium trials could be a good fit in the x games but hey only 10 guys in the world can do that. trials is pretty much the cheapest motor sport on the planet, i've raced mx, quads, jet ski's, and sports cars. trials by miles wins as the cheapest investment i've ever made. usually i only change what i break and my last bike lasted me almost 6 years.
June 16, 201313 yr Who wants to keep smashing £5000 on a pile of rocks for a plastic trophy, i do i do. the problem with the sport is what makes the sport great to us. it's not racing, it's not in a stadium where they can sit watch and order beer while a screaming announcer builds intensity and we see riders jump high in the air, or go 200 mph for 5 hours. trials is not a sport for the majority, it's slow, it's in the woods, it takes a long hike to see riders in the sections instead of the riders performing right in front of my comfy seat, while they eat over priced hot dogs drinking over priced beer. stadium trials could be a good fit in the x games but hey only 10 guys in the world can do that. trials is pretty much the cheapest motor sport on the planet, i've raced mx, quads, jet ski's, and sports cars. trials by miles wins as the cheapest investment i've ever made. usually i only change what i break and my last bike lasted me almost 6 years. You sir I salute you!!! Finally some one gets it!! The sport doesn't need to change what so ever. The approach to expanding and bringing in the auidence is what needs to be looked at. As far as im concerned the bikes need and will keep improving there will be riders willing to step up and ride the insane levels and everyone else will fall into there own category. Trials has a place for everyone it just needs to be shown off better. Edited June 16, 201313 yr by beta_trials
June 16, 201313 yr How long before Honda pull out altogether? Perhaps Dabster has a point. Wake up mate. New Mont on the way and that's official.
June 16, 201313 yr # Any more info on the new Mont / Honda? Cheers Here ya go: http://www.trialworld.es/pruebas/modernas/1211-montesa-cota-4rt-2014.html
June 17, 201313 yr # Any more info on the new Mont / Honda? Cheers from what i see in testing the new mont is prone to sudden stalling to allow teammate to finnish higher in the points. the new motor is quite enough for spectators to hear spanish obscenities. other features will be in the soon to be released spec sheet.
June 17, 201313 yr About that £5k being smashed on the rocks . Go back and read the very next sentence . Reads something like , "we all know there's more than that to it " . Know your not having a go just quote the lot . As far as people coming in and getting off their a*** and actually walking as spectators from one section to another over distance , well that is probably harder than anything else . Most people now can't and won't walk to the shop or school with their kid's god forbid actually walk near one of those great big leafy things and the green carpet like stuff , that's why stadium's are packed for the likes of speedway and road racing . Them that want will the rest who want a day out with their family with easy access to toilets , food , some where to sit where they can manage their four kids without fearing them dropping off a rock ledge wont . My wife and kid's love to come to a trial . But after two hours , the little one is playing Vikings or Army . Then he want's a ***** and where's the bog's , "err sorry love there ain't any ". Please don't pipe up , i'm generalizing . Like i said there's no simple solution ,not at least without cost . We've just got to take it as it is and make the most of it . Monts , personally think ,the designers got it right ,that's why it's stayed virtually unchanged . Don't fix stuff that ain't broke . 8k + on the rocks ,it's getting better . That's a joke by the way . Good subject Dodof2 Shy t Edited June 17, 201313 yr by shyted
June 17, 201313 yr Interesting subject in spite of the fact that its a bit off track So hey, maybe lets reword the question Does trials need to get back a generation that has stopped riding or does it need to work to appeal to the new guys who don't ride now or who's parents used to ride Do we need a bike that appeals to the tuner car generation?, the texter, the Xbox guy, skateboarder and snowboarder with their pants at their knees These are the new guys, called echo boomers and beyond it's me and its my kid I don't want a reto bike or something that looks or feels old, my kid can't relate to it either They want their own identity, personally I think the future for them is electric, downloadable maps, YouTube and Facebook integration, sounds weird but it's us that are the dinosaurs The bike that appeals to the new gen likely wont appeal to us, are the paying customer part of the problem?
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