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heavydabber

Trials and Tyres

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Just looking through the various threads and there's SO many on tyres, mainly on opinion of what's best? So I thought I'd start another ???

But standing back and looking at the subject from a different angle maybe(?), current situation is that there's only two serious, worthwhile competitive options for rear tyres anyway, Michelin and Dunlop and that's the way it's been for a good while. Both retail at well over £120 a time and it's mainly down to how much you can haggle your dealer down to for the best price. Is this doing trials any favours and is it a healthy situation to have the market dominated by just two realistic choices?

Obviously the current situation is it's a tiny and limited market with limited sales which is why costs are high and other manufacturers reluctant to get involved for little return, but do we need to keep it that way, especially if we're trying to bring people into the sport? Or stop it shrinking altogether? Do the tyre rules need changing to encourage more options?

Years ago, Sammy Miller was banging on about reducing the section of rear tires from 4.00 to 3.50 on the grounds that sections would have to be easier because of reduced grip, and it would make more land useable for trials on the same grounds. Did he have a point? Could the tyre rules be changed to allow more options and keep costs down? Discuss...

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Hi

Haven't any idea on tyres but just ordered  a front and rear mitts trials tyre for just under £100  I am returning to trials and as long as they have knobs on they will do.

The amount of use they will have it's a good chance that they will perish first

Regards 

Wayne 

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It there's only two to  h

3 hours ago, heavydabber said:

Just looking through the various threads and there's SO many on tyres, mainly on opinion of what's best? So I thought I'd start another ???

But standing back and looking at the subject from a different angle maybe(?), current situation is that there's only two serious, worthwhile competitive options for rear tyres anyway, Michelin and Dunlop and that's the way it's been for a good while. Both retail at well over £120 a time and it's mainly down to how much you can haggle your dealer down to for the best price. Is this doing trials any favours and is it a healthy situation to have the market dominated by just two realistic choices?

Obviously the current situation is it's a tiny and limited market with limited sales which is why costs are high and other manufacturers reluctant to get involved for little return, but do we need to keep it that way, especially if we're trying to bring people into the sport? Or stop it shrinking altogether? Do the tyre rules need changing to encourage more options?

Years ago, Sammy Miller was banging on about reducing the section of rear tires from 4.00 to 3.50 on the grounds that sections would have to be easier because of reduced grip, and it would make more land useable for trials on the same grounds. Did he have a point? Could the tyre rules be changed to allow more options and keep costs down? Discuss...

If there's only two to choose from then that's one more than there was for many years. Even when I was riding a lot more than I am now a Michelin lasted me for several seasons so they seem reasonable value to me.  Have you priced a similar quality tyre for a road bike?

 

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I guess I can be called stingy, but I have to watch my budget, not wanting to buy on credit. In the USA the Dunlop D803 sells for $95, the IRC TR-11 sells for $110, and the Michelin Trial X Light sells for $185.50. At the level I ride the Dunlop is fine. Friends who want more from their tire have found the IRC to work as well as the Michelin.  

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I wasn't calling you stingy - I fully subscribe to the trials rider's unwillingness to spend money. The pricing structure seems to be different in the US. From a very quick internet search the Dunlop and Michelin sell here for virtually the same price at the equivalent of 130 dollars. IRC equates to 114 dollars.

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1 hour ago, 2stroke4stroke said:

I wasn't calling you stingy

Haha, i had a post that kinda called most trials riders stingy, compared to other motorcyclists. I deleted it thinking i was going to get some abuse lol. Yes the tyres are expensive, but when you factor in everything else; fuel, the lack of a need for spares or upgrades, relatively cheap protective clothing, and most club riders go a full season on a tyre no probs, trials still works out overwhelmingly cheaper than any other motorsport.

Edited by faussy

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That's what I always thought until I was chatting with a former trials rider who, along with his son, was competing in a car hill climb. He said it was cheaper than trials, particularly as a suitable car was cheaper than a trials bike.

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i think i've posted the same answer for the last 10 to 15 years;

Top tier - Michelin X light, Michelin X11, Dunlop, IRC

middle - pirelli

bottom - mitas, vee rubber, etc

the vast vast majority of trials riders use "top tier" tyres, there are reasons to choose between them based on cost, terrain, etc. if you are very tight not that competitive, doing tones of road work then some of the cheaper ones will be OK for you, but you've got to ask why is everyone else using only the above.

 

as to lack of market competition, a mould costs a lot by all accounts, and you need to move a volume of tyres in their lifespan, plus you need to get your tyre highway approved. is there really the sales in this niche market for anyone else. maxxis have come knocking at the door with the tyre for the freeride (block spacing is too wide, so it is technically illegal). you don't see a world round in such deep mud (southern UK ???) that the advantage of an IRC would be trial winning (or for manufactures to offer a mud tyre and and dry tyre). the obvious gap in the market to many has been youth tyres for the smaller wheeled machines, but there dosn'et seam to be the sales in it to get them made.

the reference to Sammy Miller's comments is intresting as i don't myself know how a switch from 400x18 to 350x18 would make enough of a diffrence to to justify the switch. the move (pre ww2???) to the current tyre pattern (to make trials open / to save land from errosion) was a bold move but has it taken the sport down this cul-de-sac of a handfull of competitive tyre manufactures?

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It's amazing what slippery stuff they can get a trials car up on the standard road tyres they have to use. Some of it many of us would be struggling with on a trials bike.

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I use Michelin X11, compared to road bike tyres they are well priced

Enduro tyres cost more and last less, when trail riding and doing roadwork - we generally use a harder compound rear, for road use and I am using a Metzeler MC360 on the rear and it's like a brick, it's that hard

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On 2/17/2020 at 10:56 PM, baldilocks said:

What happened to Golden Tyre?

really good question

there was a guy in mx pusing them heavily, lots of advertising but its all gone quiete, a quick google dosen't show much active in the UK

motomrelin does a good review of their trials tyre - https://www.motomerlin.co.uk/blog/?p=1703 - but thats 6 years ago!

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I'd always buy Michelin,  for the trials I ride, predominantly rocks, they have been the best tyre for nearly 40 years. Tried Dunlop before , not really impressed but understand latest ones are better. IRC not a million miles away but no cheaper and easier to puncture?

Trials riders do make me laugh , people pay £100 for a sticker kit but don't own a pressure gauge and then run second rate tyres to save £20/£30.

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