aawil

hi mike it looks like a suzuki but you have a great start you can use the rim and you should get away with the security bolts ,the rear spindle /spacers /bearings ect will easily mod to fit in a british hub company hub and you can also mod the brake plate if the hub you find is the same diam, i have just stripped a yamaha dt 125 rear wheel and used all of the parts except the hub ,i have even cleaned up and used the old spokes as luckily the sizes were ok the hub i used was from a 1955 125 f/barnett and it will be on the bike that i am going to ride in the sammy miller series this year,,you seem to be getting the idea of making good trials bike without throwing a fortune at it ,welcome to the sensible side of classic trials, will

hi deryk ,i sure do it looks like the group at lambs lair ,muddy and slippery but with the sections set wide enough to try various lines a slow sensible approach to get grip ,or my way flat out in third and hang on, both styles had equal success, on the topic of the cotswolds trials charlie are the fairbrothers still around with there influence in the acu and experience,of s/cars , i for one will be delighted to ride and will be quite willing to offer advice to any clubs on traditional sidecar sections , will,

i did not mention bantam/cub hubs most old l/weights used british hub company wheels , about the same size as cub ones weigh less and have 36 spoke holes,i recently bought a pair of an old f/barnet on ebay for £38, my local bike breaker has piles of used D I D alloy rims from trail bikes that he sells for a £10 note what i do is take the wheels strip the old spokes out keep the rims ,tapes .security bolts and give him back the hubs oops a small mistake in that as have about 1000 spokes in stock i forgot to price them ,so add another £100 so what have we got basic cost of about £250-£350,depending on the spacers and sprocket ,i still cannot see how you can spend £1500 on a set of wheels unless you have totally new everything including the hubs ,its great as i know people who have spent a fortune on replica rickman conical hubs (the lovely shiny ones that take bantam/cub brake shoes)only to find that the steel original weigh slightly less, so i ask myself why i have only been building competition bikes for 50 years and never made a shiny one yet, and i thought the idea of classic trials was to finish and enjoy yourself and if you win sometimes that is a bonus, will

,and i thought sanity was returning to our sport even in dollars $2000 seems totally over the top unless gold or titainiam spokes are the latest fashion a pair of l/weight hubs any early british l/weight ,will have 36 spoke holes , a pair of used alloy rims from a jap trail bike, and 72 spokes/nipples , new brake shoes sealed bearings alloy wheel spacers/snail cams and a dural rear sprocket,add 3 security bolts (alloy) and a pair of tyres and tubes you end up with a light and eligible set of wheels ready to go out and ride ,i know this can be done easily for £250 as i have just built a pair for my latest panther lightweight trials outfit,if you cannot do it yourself add another £50 -£100 for labour /using my own labour i reckon to build the new outfit which will be competetive for about £1500 so does spending what i consider a stupid amount of money on a trick bike make you a better rider,, i think not ,so the sooner we all get back to reality,keep within the spirit of the sport and have a good time riding instead of polishing i at least will be happy will

hi charlie and deryk ,been away for a while but i am now back in the land of the living ,do i see common sense starting to prevail over this great sport that we used to enjoy lets hope so as i am getting on a bit (a sprightly 72 this week ) i have had to realise that a big panther outfit is becoming to heavy to pick up , so soon i will be out on a 250 panther outfit one of the later panther two strokes, with a few mods it should be fun to ride ,i met up with doug sherbourne back in the summer and we sort of decided to both come out and have a final fling at the sammy miller series and maybe show these youngsters a thing or two even it is only about enjoying yourself on competetive trials outfits that probably cost not much more than £1500 to build and run,so keep up the good work . and if any organiser wants help and or advice on laying out real classic sections in the east ,you only have to ask will

it sounds like you have a well sorted triumph cub but why oh why is it in the pre 65 bit of the forum. will.

when i started riding trials in the south midland center most of our trials were mud mud and more mud as most events were run in the winter time , i along with a lot of riders raced bikes in the summer, and found that what we learned riding on mud in the w,inter helped our racing in slippery conditions you only rode on rocks when you ventured to the north, those lads would beat most of us hands down but boy did we get our own back when they came down south,so the only way to get on was to travel around the country to ride,where else could you have flat out in 3rd sections and thats with a big triumph motor, , i now have fun knowing that i may be rubbish on rocks , but finding grip in deep mud or wet grass is no problem it is called throttle control, a certain ulsterman with a big ariel proved that, in those days there was only one course just experts and novices all riding the same,,your first target was to finish with you and the bike in one bit, then hopefully one day you would finish with no fives, , i found the only way to learn was to enter as many national trials that i could, as a novice a hard learning curve,then i could ride all sorts of sections ,,will

A BIT LATE it is a std bsa c15 frame with an added top tube to strengthen the steering head, and a few extra brackets to hold the tank, the rear footrest arms have been cut off as well,coupled with the *****welding its not the best modifyed road c15 frame i have seen will.

re your kt over the years i have fitted a small wire wound resistot on various off road lighting set ups , the one i use is from one of the small hondas, costs about £12 and is easy to fit having just one wire , i will be back in my workshop on thur and can sort one out if you wish (complete with a simple wiring diagram) pm me if this is any help, will.

interesting , back in the seventies i turned up with a 156cc fantic outfit much to the amusment of most of the other riders , the critics quickly dissapeared and the rest was history, now i have enough parts to build a really light 185 bantam so i suppose i try and build a competetive trials bantam outfit just for fun and of course to upset the same old critics again ,oh what fun being retired is , will.

you can still get a usable villiers powered bike for around £1200 you dont need to spend a fortune on loads of shiny fancy fashionable bits keep the steel rims , footrests and bars you will just need a pair of decent tyres,(i use hidenau trials tyres at about £80 pair ),and sort out the ignition system(another £225 )you then have a british classic trials mount ready to ride and win awards in the right hands for a total outlay of £1500, me i ride a 1958 greeves ta fitted with a homemade s/car,powered by a 197 villiers motor with a go kart top end and ajax head ,starts first kick dead reliable good enough to win a few awards , and with a few mods i will be riding the twinshock sammy miller rounds next year ,the total cost of my old greeves was about £900 on the road so keep it sensible and get out and enjoy yourself,if that dont work i can always give you a closer look at classic trials from a comfy sidecar , will.

hi try asking the same question on the greeves riders assocation web site as most of the experts seem to be members even some of the factory workers ,they welcome anybody with a greeves based bike.and i believe that you do not have to join to get an answer , i would personally join the club then you get full access to the lot including factory drawings , good luck ,, will.

hi paul yes i am still riding and building strange outfits , doing a few long distance events ,the sections suit this old worn out rider and nobody moans when i turn up and ride without a passenger just a rusty lump of iron strapped in the chair, if you are back in the uk let me know and deryk you have beat me to it i had either the burdge family or the harrisons in my notes to send you so keep up the good work , cheers will.

this lot makes great reading and brings a smile to my face , the same arguments have been used over and over again during my short trials riding career, but as i have only been riding the things for 45 years what do i know,,this situation was happening in the seventies when deryk and the yorkshire lads decided that a simpler form was needed for the real trials riders on real trials bikes,it worked for 10 years we had a good set of proven sections in a well contested championship i enjoyed nearly every event and made some long lasting friends over the years where else could you ride the same sections that you read about and admired in the blue and green uns weekly as a spotty schoolboy, luckily for me a road racing accident left me with a badly damaged left leg so i had no choice but to either retire or take up the gentle art of s/car trials,the chairs won and suddenly i found a world of riders who were out to ride , not moan about rules, we made our own , if the section was reckoned to be dangerous we altered it to suit us, the spectators loved us the only folk who objected seemed to be some solo riders in shiny suits on shiny bikes i personally thought they could not understand,how we could enjoy riding so much and assumed we were not serious,how wrong they were..my solution is to get out and ride with what ever you can afford be it solo or s/car.enjoy yourself and you could try using the rule book as a door stop. there is a club out there who will welcome you with open arms ,if you want to ride get on with it. if you want to get into politics try another sport. will,,

hi deryk and charlie its a pity that a lot of modern riders and course plotters have not had the experience of a real classic trial such as the tour of islwyn , how about a long section with two subs , with just a set of begins cards and a set of ends about 1/4 mile further up all in a natural rocky gully ridden by all classes including s/cars , maybe todays riders would have problems deciding which line to use without loads of tapes and markers to show them the way , i would still love to scrutineer some of the bikes , i think i will voulenteer my services to the t.a.l.m.a.g. next year that would be putting something back into the sport, after a quick stay in hospital i will be back riding my 197cc greeves outfit in a few events later in the year just me and a 56lb weight bolted in the chair as ballast , at last a passenger who does not moan when we are upside down, cheap classic trials total cost to build an award winning genuine pre 65 outfit £785, cheers for now ,, will ,

wallo this is making me envious weybridge on a big trials outfit now that is a proper classic section , looks like i will be back riding full time next year (thanks to the N H S for the rebuild) is you see her give julie my love gcheers will.

just get a couple of mates to give you push then once running you can set i tto a fast tickover to let it bed in , i have found that some of the bushes are a tad to thick leaving you with no end play and a tight engine the real answer is to pull it apart shorten the bush a bit then shim the crank to give the correct clearance , i would give it about 10 thou with the cases tightened,will

yes they are a very good copy of the mk1 concentric amal i have compared both and to be honest it looks a better job than the real one they are fully ethanol proof with adjustable float level which makes fine tuning a bit easier, and new come as two or fourstroke types i hope that helps will

i have one on my greeves scottish outfit ,another on my panther stroud replica ,and have supplied and fitted about ten to various bikes all with no problems , on my own bike i use the chromed brass slide that is an extra , so no problems once set up and a great price , will

hi welcome to the mad mad world of trials sidecars, i have only been riding them for 42 years and still enjoy riding with or without a passenger ,you will have a load of fun and it will keep you fit , will

i am with deryk and charlie get an old trail bike sling a triumph 500 unit motor in then bolt a sidecar on you now have a cheap fun trials outfit capable of winning the sammy miller championship , all you have to do is ride it better than the rest ,you could put one together at todays prices go out and have fun and get change out of £1500. me i ride a 1958 197cc greeves scottish with a homemade chair .total cost on the road and its competetive £965, all we need now is to go back to one route for all classes ,you then get wide sensible sections that we can all enjoy without having to spend a fortune on trick fancy frames and bits or am i just getting to old ,.will

charlie back in my road racing days with bsa outfits we allways used either renyolds 531 or T45 tubing both had nickel content we used bronze rods with a gasflux unit as that type of tube goes brittle if heated to much , great to work with and we built lots of outfits i cant remember them breaking up even when i bounced of the wall at ramsey hairpin one year,. will

deryk a bit more info the unknown crew are the other lads who used to travel with mike&frank ,father and son the roberts and our mystery pair mike had a big big trailer that took all 3 outfits,to your events and the bonanza, when it was not being used to carry mobile toilets , ,mikes outfit was black and i believe had norton forks with a ariel leader front hub, ben and ? roberts outfit was red ,but its not them,will

deryk its not mike and frank but i do reconise the outfit the brain might take a while to work these days , but i know i have a photo of the pair somewhere,with the names on , mike always blamed me for keeping frank in the bar drinking with the serious s/car crews till the early hours ,before a championship round ,i always felt i rode better with a hangover ,but i dont think frank did,much to mikes concern , will

deryk i am not sure as i have only got half of the photos , if i can see the passenger it would help .if it is frank i should be sure when i see who is in the chair,, will.