sting32

Without being confrontational, and all that... Cope, can you clear something up for me, about Texas/oklahoma trials? I hear NEOTT is or has went, the AMA route, what about your club and ntta? {I think it is?} so are you all (and visitors) required to join AMA now to ride all/any events or just the big ones?

where are the Lanes world archived at? I paid support here, and I really liked to hear what was posted in not every forum here, but definitely in the LW forum, what is up?

sounds like 83 when it is played to the end, I didnt post it, I just found it posted elsewhere...

Neat clip, I think this is the 3rd such TV show clip I have seen, 1st with Bernie in it! (usa fans!) http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...885468051222934

Post the next ledge/part, Nabbit, you tease?!?!?!? I wanna see him go!

least ya didn't pick on me for Devorce, IE, Divorce, for us country singer types... Chader, you need to keep us informed on what you are up to, did you pick a bike, and all that. I love tracking newbies to the sport, in fact I am trying to make it my life's work, lol... making trials newbs and tracking them. Remember the biggest and best rule in trials is, BRING A FRIEND

we have one thing in common, I restarted or went back to trials competition for myself after my devorce. Im engaged again, but I plan to be able to continue trials still. I started many years ago, (70's) quit after Highschool (84) started again in 02, thanks to help from my dad... otherwise, I was messed up. Shop carefully that is all I can add to this..

I have a 96 250 gasgas to sell, PLUS a 95 160 for 2000 obo. that 160 Make a good girlfriend/wife or teen bike. As you might well already have experienced with bicycle Trials, everything about them will be MAIL ORDER... meaning break on Sunday, be able to ride by next weekend. Break like on Sat, before the trials, if you don't have a spare and nobody else does, you

That is a kewl friggin little bike, home made?

My old schooler's opinion (back when these were not as old as they are now) was to remove the oil pump, mix the fuel remove any doubt or chances that oil was not getting to the engine. Plus, If for no other reason, when we did this back in '74, I then also used the same can as my dad and everyone else at the trials. No more ooops wrong can for his bike ordeals when we did this. But nowdays the watercooled bikes run just fine with 80:1 (full synthetic) not sure I call that enough for the air cooled machines, especially if like me when I was younger I might go "flat Trackin" down the trails on my ty because the other kids had enduro's or MX's. My son's ty80 already had the pump off but he had his own can of gas with 32:1 in it, NON synthetic, (if you use 100% synthetic do 50:1).

Ya'll lambasted me good on this one fair enough with my windy posts. Yes, I did NOT go. I wanted to go, worse than I had ever wanted to go in my life so far... But I had graduation and wedding for the daughter, for the 1st 2 weekends of rounds (4 events). Yes, my dad was 70 class. I no longer feel the desire to go as strongly. wondered who else thought the same? Quote from RTCLICK---->, Sting!! am a correct in assuming that you think the support line at the US nationals is too hard, and would better serve trials if it was eased enough to allow novice/intermediate riders to compete. Well, My riding must suck worse than I ever imagined, since there is no way in hell I would say that the sections and the loop at the "nationals" were anything but EXPERT and up, from all reports (look at the scores). My dad and I have been in and around trials since 71, we are dam near same skill level, especially since he is in better shape than I am. For all of you who know GW, for my 1st 18 years of my life, dad would tell me... "Mitchy, they will wheel me, out to my Bultaco, in my wheelchair, and I will still beat your ass!" That was my motivation, and I love the hell out of him always have. RTclick, I know you joined the conversation late, I did suggest that "what if" & the meet might be better, success if we invited EVERYONE to come compete, made it a tad less difficult, instead of the top 10% of the riders? My answer to my own question still is: hell if I know. I figured the success of each "round" as far as club, or in Browns case, the "Gate" as it were, is what makes events a success or not? or is that just stoopid of me to think, with 500 riders means more "gate"? Ground is drying up, and maybe something to consider, how to keep some? or to get more? if profits can be seen to at least help with Insurance payments? I dunno. FWIW... I have come to the conclusion, that this stuff is too involved to talk about in posts because only one of you can or have seen where I am going with anything, I type. others just assume I am just bitchin to bitch. I was going to say a lot more details that I feel back up my points, yet feel too many of you get lost in the forest of what I say. if we were sitting around a campfire, maybe this conversation would evolve into the discussion I had hoped. instead it seems to be nothing but "pot shots" at off the topic stuff.

HOw hard can it be to start a conversation with those who went to the nationals, who are NOT the top 30% of the riders in skills and ability, who attend the nationals? lastly who even have computers and read TC? aparently 5 of us. Duh! <quote> I know as we filled out the forms, ony cirticism would be is that it many loops and sections were way to hard IMHO for many, below pro/highest class below pro. FWIW, If we thougth it was just too hard for us, I would've kept my thoughts and opinions to myself you know... <endquote> It is a dead horse, nobody else wants to dare say, MAYBE the nationals are over most rider's heads, that was my point.

Thanks Sherpa, that is pretty much our sentiment. got to ask though, "pay for it how?" you feel like we are alienating ourselves by daring to speak up? ---- This thread got off on the wrong foot, as I started out to be funny, then it evolved to a serious question. Then the post originally, didnt even post (the entire text I had typed and finally wanted to post was "cleared" and I recieved that 404 not found error). I went back to the posting page and viola, all was lost. Still I had an agenda, I wanted some imput, from more than just the few guys I heard and overheard, from so I then ran with a hack job of what I tried to say... Hence the messed up topic and description. Anyway, I started this thread, to kind of get a feeling from other attendees... As I was thinking 'fairly,' that everyone wants to know what to "improve on" and get feedback about the nationals, especially (insert trials masters name here). Honestly how do you rate the nationals? IMHO, I think 99% said it was pretty dam good, appreaciating the extraordinary hard work to those who put it on, but also the volunteers <Plus figuring the "for what it is and was" history, I guess> I know as we filled out the forms, ony cirticism would be is that it many loops and sections were way to hard IMHO for many, below pro/highest class below pro. FWIW, If we thougth it was just too hard for us, I would've kept my thoughts and opinions to myself you know... and maybe it is just me (us). maybe you all think it aint so bad. well this is how I hoped to find out, posting... Now because I dont think it is "just me" and that I was thinking how if we spoke up, we just might keep more of the "base" of riders involved with trials and big competitions. I feel well, there is this some what less "risk" rider, where the majority of us trials enthusiasts exist. I think, these are the guys and gals, that would love to have an honest competition on reasonable sections on a reasonable loop, but against fellow similiar skill level riders. These are whom I hope would also want to attend such an event? Yeah I too see the 2 sides to even my question/suggestion, those of us who are gung ho, go for broke type of competitiors have the nationals as they are now, to fullfill that once or 4 times a year inclination to "risk it all" to prove to no one but themselves how good they really are. So I assume you wont come because you assume it would be "to easy"? But as I look at results I think not only dad and others like him, came away from the overdone toughness of the nationals, some what glad he was still walking, unlike the other guys who entered.... with that "wow, not sure I am up to doing this again, ever..." (not withstanding there are some of us, including me, that risk disability/injury solely because I have not gotten into even close to the "fitness" level I would need to ride on National as they are... let alone 5 rounds). Maybe that is the target? I dont think that was the target.

Does anyone have the dimensions of that 06? we havent takend dad's 06 apart yet, and the part number is same as 05 until last digit, not that it matters but I bet they are same diameter as the 04 & o5 pros, arent they? Maybe we're lucky they are just softer than say the o4? I (er actually someone did) added an inch to the spacer in my 04, but did it with a valve spring (much harder to compres but it would). what they did was cut 2 inches off the spacer, then insert this valve spring (that is roughly 3 inches long) making it one inch longer, yet it will compress if pushed that far. BTWI have a napa number for the valve spring for the 04, like I said I havent taken the 06 apart, probably wont for a couple months form now. But if you tell me the diameter of the 06 spring, using caliper, Ill compare to the spring I have, I'd bet it works... FWIW, wonder if an 04 spring is tougher but same? 06 spring part # is: bt280414106 05 is this : bt280414105 04 is this : bt280414108 this from the manuals on gasgas UK's site... like I said, maybe some more than just last number means big difference, but might get lucky and it is only lenght or strenght? I believe 05' & 04 are same fork, right?

Not sure, where did you send it? gmail? Yahoo? Ill look. I get a little too much garbage, hope I didnt goof and toss it too... BTW, gmail & yahoo are my only 2 emails I use anyhow.

RL... about muenster... Unfortunately, I have prior commitments.. I started the post, reworded it several times, trying to make sure I didnt offend, then it would NOT post (or seemed not to.) then I hastily re-pasted my last version over top what did post, ending up with 2 posts lol.. so I should pretty much rewrite the whole famn ding... What I was going for, hmmm... I was wondering what other riders felt about the nationals and how obviously over most of us's head it (by many accounts) seemed to be? Maybe it is just right for what it is! (I would agree with that too, for what is is... so think of me as just being devils advocate now...) I look at the results since only pop made it this year, I hope to go in the future, for the reason you stated, "wont know how bad I am until I go there..." If I save up (yeah in this day no worse than probably years ago) to do these things, how bad will I risk being able to work on monday after the trials, for one, and will I have fun? What about the "rest of us" that are semi dedicated to improving, that show up monthly rain or shine, I am suggesting that the rest of us might be an untapped market for a big trials event? This is going hand in hand in what Dan Brown has going, a nice resort for trials to happen on. I thought I seen where someone said or he said he thnks he might break even with the nationals & the pros' weekend this past year... Well? it seems to suggest that he (trials in general) needs more venue's? the whole numbers thing. you know as well as I do trials is a small, tiny percentage of even off road section of motorcycle/atv riders in the USA. (unlike over seas by the sounds of it). So then we have a national, that seemingly is not only pretty tough to "put on" but by shear Skills alone required to compete, excludes 90% of the general membership across the country (guessing)? Im thinking with this year, & no world rounds, It just might be an opening to an idea? THEN, in my question is aimed 180 degrees out of phase with Michlin, instead of trying to produce an increas of the "pro" trials rider base in the usa, wonder if we shouldn't be tapping into the larger base that already exists? The amature... Right now, for people like the die hards that arent going to ever achieve top class status, are however more likely to have the where with all (funds, desire, dedication) to compete in a venue that doesn't attempt to hurt them. Been wrestling with this one... as I typed the original post... One thing about golf, there is a handicap system that let me (a casual player) play with just about anyone, in the "leagues" at the country club, and still have a chance to win, Plus I wont be risking broken bones to prove how dang good I am. Trials is so much akin to golf... Maybe ESPN will invent "Extreme golf" in the future, where to be the best you have to be able to hit a golfball while flying a parachute from the radio tower above green #3?? And Motomilt can infer that I am wuss, when I pass on that too... (LOL). NO I know he didnt, someone will though..

I dont know what you guys thought of the nationals, I want some of you guy's that showed up, opinions. What about the rest of us? Unlike Michlin wants to think or make it out to be, Trials is an AMATURE sport in the USA... remember, Motocross used to be the same, so maybe in the future it will happen to trials... but right now admit it, trials is AMATURE sport. Reason I bring this up? well... I just wonder what you other "clubmen" think? Right now, the biggest class at most of our clubs here in the middle USA,(meaning the most riders drawn to show up and compete MONTHY, not the once a friggin year crowd) is Amature, Intermediat, and Sr expert (on that list we all were talking about it would be classes 2 below the best rider in the club rides... I bet you it is the same where you live... Huston, we have a problem.... So each year Trials puts on an event to test the what, <1% of the population of motorcycle enthusiasts across the country, an admittly niche group. And of that NICHE community, only the top 5-10% of that small group, barely are even qualified to ride the loop, let alone compete? FWIW, with some long discussion (not on a message board anywhere) what this has caused IMHO, is that to then to modify this situation of way to friggin tough sections is, riders are smart, they move down in classes (some refer to this as sand baggin although I wont and dont). So what do we need to agree to do, now that I brought this up for argument? nothing. just want to see if you guys think the same as me, the same as I think I see competitiors are doing, and since I have been riding almost 33 years. Pro's being a 0, best club champs being a 1, Experts being a 2, Im a 3, {sometimes I feel more like maybe a 4 some weekends, when I dont ride very well (lol)}. Ok, but! At this level, I am and would be a lot more willing to travel the country to compete against like level riders on like sections. My gripe is that, I dont need to drive 1000+ miles to FIVE out of 12 of the 18 sections each loop, that they think I am going to skinny up the side of that cliff (or some risky object), and drop 4ft into a pile of rocks, Hell I can drive 2 miles and NOT do that right here where I live! That stuff is for the expert & masters to do (and pro's of course). But, This is where I am comfortable and feel I more than challenge myself each month. But had I made it to the nationals, I doubt I would have called it that much fun? (sorry my dad and many buddies did, so Im going off his and others accounts of the trials). **** Edit, didn't mean for it to read like I put words into dads mouth, yeah he had a blast, worked his butt off. We do that, & we call it fun, probably why we bother to compete in th 1st place is because it is fun. what I cant find words to express correctly is: more generic "FUN" that makes you say "wow, cant wait to do that again" as apposed to "Ok, I went, but I cant do that anymore..." That better explanation? hope so ***** Maybe my question from the outset of this post should have read: When & Where is the "nationals" for the rest of us going to be held? Maybe there is more support for a nationals at the lower levels? plus a little less difficulty in putting on such an event, which might appeal to the bigger "market" of riders in our niche sport? Warning! Im not picking on anyone, Not Lane, not Dan Brown, nobody! Not anyone involved with any previous rounds, hardly even the whole NATC or national supporters or anything, if you think I am, ignore the post and read something else...

BUMP!! Yeah Cope. What is the skinny? and will it be "everyone at once" type of school, kinda like when Chaves took the kids around Disney last year? Spinner, if he's get'n info to you off-site, let me know.

It is the almighty dollar guys, nothing beats it. how do you sell tickets to a rally? lets see: stand somewhere along the 12 mile course, to see cars stream by one every minute or so? or like Nascar, where you see 42 cars in some cases all around the track all at once for like 2.5 hours or more... (like bristol, the BEST ticket in nascar IMHO but also the rarest only like 500000 seats at that track...) If you had basketball or football like trials or rally contests, you would be hard pressed to sell tickets. Lets see... Football, rally style... Hmm invision, each house with usable front yard, on the block of Second Avenue, will see one play. then we move onto the next yard...

Dear Journal, I was on ebay all week looking for "Bic and Pad" motorcycle club software. After hours using Ebays search engine, no Dice... But luckily, I found it via google search, funny though Ebay wanted me to prove I was over 18, and accept the consequences of "looking in this area." Hope mom dont find out. Ill write more when the package arrives.

I liked what I read... I hesitate to ask this, because it seems to be "ANAL" (the rule not the question). 4 e Missed section... I got to say, I have been to many many trial's (I hate to dog any clubs that I have visited there is NOT a one, where this cant and doesnt easily happen at, especially if you dont know the area) However the Northern Texas club, last year for the 2 day regionals, had it remarkably well marked... If missing a section is going to be imposed a seeminlgy hard luck no arguement penalty, 10 points (I assume by reading if you missed it all 3 loops you would incur 30 points, instead of the 15 for failure to navigate the section, in my mind I gave up the chance to get better than a 5, let alone clean it. then: To prevent "missed sections" IMHO, there need to be a guideline that course marking should leave no doubt of the course or path of the loop, the loop markers must be laid out in such a way that standing at one marker, you can see the marker ahead of you, and behind you, wether it pieplate or ribbons (prefered) "unless the path has no alternate choices, or crossing paths. Example, if you mark a deer trail through a heavily wooded area, and off path navigation is tedious, then it can be assumed the competitiors, wont go off track for fear of getting lost, will not get off the path, then fewer markers are needed in a given path. in these cases, however, I still like to see the loop markers (sometimes just ribbondangling from a tree branch) along the trail up to every 60 seconds down the trail (at reasonable rate loop speeds not full on harescramble speeds the pro's might do) so that riders can HAVE assurances they are on the right path... I rode down a loop once for seemingly 15 minutes between sections, on the second loop that is, I got lost the 1st loop, it was 20 minutes before I knew I was off loop, because of some marking... I was NOT the only one. _____________________________________________________________ Side note... about scorecards and DNF's and missed sections. I guess dont get it, how this even became an issue? You see, I dont know about your thoughts (everyone in here) but a scorecard to me is handed out with all 5's already implied, no not marked, but if the judge didnt mark the 3,2,1 clean then it is assumed to be a failure to navigate... I as a rider, go out and get proof from the scoring person that I in fact did better than a 5, or did not as the case may be, lol he punches the 5 (technically so I know I tried it the specified # of loops). when I turn my card in, I am handing in my proof of accomplishment. so technically as I look at it, if someone doesnt want to ride section #4, they do not need to, they should just drive to section #5. when scorecards are turned in, all sections ridden that day need to be checked for a punch or mark, if no punch or mark, then either mark the 5's for each loop, or punch the 5 for any missed score marks. if there are a only 3 sections attempted out of 15 then DNF, I dunno. I know someone will be able to tell me why this is a rule with a penalty, was added (not just to Dbrowns draft, I know it is from FIM or somewhere already...) and I mean more than the penalty inherntly was... Thanks!

Cant agree much more...Ya got to thank MTV.... & nintendo. But <insert Monty Python's brians song here> lookin on the bright side of this: One thing about this new "lifesytle" that is emerging with these Twits that cant wait to die or risk death, is that at least Darwins theory of "natural selection" is being engaged, which apparently has NOT been, for many generations. I say, if you see stupid people doing stupid stuff... you know like lighting themselves on fire to be on a buddy's website, then maybe we need to encourage that. Eliminating some of the stupid genes from the human genpool one dipsh!t at a time.

Quickly, our family has 2 04's, and one 06 300's. the 04's, each I have modified the springs a bit to give us more "pre load" since I am quite bit heavier than Adam Raga, Now then is everything the same in the 06? I think there was some subtle changes... 1st of all, can I get the stiffer springs for it, or even better take the ones out of the 04? they seem different, and in the (usa versions of the bike are sold with a maintenence video DVD) and it mentions that they not only changed the forks to Aluminum, they also shortened the amount of travel or just the lenght of the tubes that go inside the forks, a wee bit (FWIW, Yes, it has been week or two since I saw that part of the demo-manual, while I was actually looking for the part about piston ring gaps...) Any info would be greatly appreciated... Im hunting for the parts-PDF thing as we speak, thanks..

Dabs, I think you have stumbled into exactly why this has been talked about so much lately... I covered this, and others helped and filled in, problem is how we get it "to be"? I dont have the resources unless you are talking posting internet sites, drawing grass roots support for what should be a no brainer. I too said, and many concured (last I checked, I could be wrong) to where differences could be ironed out, BUT in essense: 0= pro 1= master or known as Expert at national level 2= expert, or known as ES or Expert Sportman 3= Intermediate should be a national level equal to the toughness of the easier or easiest(?) lines that were used for the men, in age bracketed SUPPORT CLASSES... where the up can coming experts and masters compete in a field of LIKE SKILLED riders. My (not solely mine mind you) would also allow, that you could have age groups like we do now, to keep people involved that feel past thier prime and all that (like me) but start them at 40 and up, or even 50 in 5 year increments. {Each class LEVEL, gets its own color plate } have a class of 3.5 meaning 3 level over 50? 3.6 is 3 level 60 or over etc... Maybe this left the way it is now I guess instead reinventing the nationals plate system? {edited 7-7-06} 4= amature 5= novice 6= beginner or new riders if you have them now then all that a responsible club would NEED to do is semi-self evaluate themselves on how hard say thier womans class is, or novice or whatever and the kids... like if they are riding expert lines, or are riding they probably ride 3a, or something where as I know the gals I watch at Nebraska and texas (dont have any women riders in KS ya know...) are probably 6 F or 6.W or so... {edit 7-7-06) --- maybe from here down about the plates could be left alone...--- later a specified colors of plates, could be used to denote classes, AND JUST SO YOU ALL KNOW>>> I to would hate havin a red plate on my blue bike for example... BUT!!! then again I ONLY have to wear that plate for a national or a regional so I could live with it, HELL!!! I could even be proud as hell to have the 3rd place (or 20th place) (I just randomly picked a color here) >> RED plate for class for the USA Nationals Trials Ranking... IT could be so sweet and coveted... a trophy itself just like that AMA #1 plate is for Racers...

Just make sure you get the VCR's set! There will be some Trials Riding on Prime time TV this week... About the show... http://abc.go.com/primetime/masterofchampions/index.html Notice the description at the website for the epside? ROFL... A low-rider car jumps rope and a world record card thrower slays fruit - - plus an Urban Freestyle match and a yo-yo showdown that keep things rolling! Sniplets of an Email that I got follwoing this subject... email forwarded from others until it got to me {including GasGas USA Importer Dale Malasek} It reads: from Barry Florin describing the events they and Chris went through before the show even started.....also details about the airing of the show This Thursday evening. June 29th 2006 Here is a brief history of how this all transpired; I was contacted by several ABC sports representatives several months ago about the sport of trials and how impressive the rider's abilities were. They wanted to know if it would be possible to have several of my best riders on the "Master of Champions" show to do a version of an indoor trials competition. Over a several week period, we worked out a scenario of obstacles based on what the riders could do with the trials bikes.....and with Chris and Keith, pretty much anything was possible, much to their amazement. ABC flew Chris and Keith out to Los Angeles, shipped their bikes out also. They had two days of practice and section tune-up (Tuesday and Wednesday) and then the live show was on Thursday. Millions of people will see this show and will be made aware of the Sport of Trials, so this should be a big shot in the arm for the sport, as well as "Star" status for Chris and Keith! So, be sure to tune in to the ABC channel next Thursday evening at 8:00 EST. You might want to check your TV guide to be sure of the channel and time for this show. Reguards, Dale {end of snipplets from my email} Please excuse any mistakes in punctuation, & layout & omissions, I didnt copy the ENtire message, & the email "quote stripper" program I used, well it aint much, but copied enough to get the idea.