sting32

Base gasket cant be 2. something mm. we're talking tenths .x and or hundredths .0x of mm in thicknesses of available gasktes. AND, JUST FYI! the ENGINE was assembled in factory with a "standard thickness base gasket" then the clearances on piston to head is measured, then gasket thickness is determined to make sure minimum clearances exist, sometimes less thick gasket is used or thicker gaskets is used. FWIW, mine had 2 gaskets from factory I think total .08 thickness. I doubled that for my 06 300 pro, loved it. I didnt do that stator adjustment nor head spacer. Coolant drain, remove radiator cap, remove brass part showing at waterpump housing, (uses not an allen wrench, but a Star wrench, BTW this part is also the bearing for the impeller shaft, it has a tiny thin thrust washer on it, watch to see where it ends up. refer to gasgas.com website with vids on youtube about the waterpump so you might now what you have lost or not. you never get all the water out, but I have removed the hoses then blew air in to head holes (make sure radiator cannot be connected via hoses at all!!!!) to help clear more of it. I think your muffler could been cracked at mounting points, I know I had to have mine welded up and built up a bit on the 300, especially as much as we fall down practicing. that silencer can have a lot of leverage on muffler, you know. hole in muffler, then fast rides down trails with excessive oil getting spewn then lit with hot-high rpm exhaust temps, plus outside air, it would be like a chiminea http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimenea if you race down a trail at high RPM, best to let bike cool itself (especially exhaust) by idleing (or riding like trials) for a minute, IMHO.

(HeeHaw <TV SHOW> singing bit/skit) "...So you'll never hear one of us repeating gos_sip you better you better be sure... to listen close the 1st time..."

172 views, that is good. I guess nobody has opinion on my opinion, which is also good.

I am proud to announce that the (I think it is USA/Canada) clublist' has been revived. Thanks to the efforts put forth by these guys: Bob Clancy (South Mt. Web Design) and Trev Clancy (Trialdogmotorsports). Direct link is http://www.trialsclubs.us/ I didnt look yet, I think it will also be linkded from NATC's site... No I havent been there in a couple weeks. If you have information about clubs, dont be afraid to share it! there is a link to email bob & Trev. If you notice non working or old information, it is because nobody seems to know the current info. So,letting someone know is good, especially helpfull if you know and if you can give the "good" info. Now all we need is to (Id help) get clubs to get the information out there, on websites, and readable. No more stick line drawing maps, google and mapquest are essential. GPS Coordinates are even better! We can't get people to come see or try it, if they cannot find it. I'm posting this, be cause I am excited. I believe this list is probably the #1 resource that TRIALS (aka Moto Trails) has to try to keep up. Finding clubs nowdays, is not like it was 20 or so years ago, when you could find club flyers in ANY cycle shop's bulleten Boards. I know we talk to at least 1 person each trials weekend, after the trials when fueling up for the trip home. This is just me and my family (1 unmarked pickup truck with the bikes in plain view) stopping at a busy 'Quik Trip' (gas n go store) in Northern Wichita KS. I feel it is important, because I Think about how we have a town in Kansas that one weekend a month, maybe every weekend a month, I havent been to one of these but I know plenty that have.... But there is something like 600-1,000 harleys meet in a town of less than 1200 population, to eat breakfast. (south dakota does this on a HUGE scale, every year, called STURGIS). It started by word of mouth, then people seeing people riding there on a schedule, and it grew and grew... I feel Trials can build up the same way, by becomming VISIBLE. ALl the time I meet people that wanna ride and not risk serious injury... Maybe clubs should plan to meet for breakfast or after the trials get a pop at a gas n pop, in a highly visible area, so people notice them. Post comments below.

Makes me think, at first glance, that the oil being used is frothing or foaming, might try a different brand. if there are air bubbles (they go away over time you know) being produced from the hard use trials you talk about, maybe too thin weight, but betting it "might" be the oil? what would be nice to see is, get the bike to do its symptoms, then hopefully, drain without any time for the oil to recover... & see if I was right? I'm just guessing though, seems possible, hydraulic systems have this problem when hot and high use, but most designers create a huge collection container into the system so the oil can recover, hard to do that in shock/forks.

No problem about the time, as you know hard to diagnose let alone recall the same type of bike I had (99txt300). I just dont remember there being a big clutch dragging problem, but then again I came from a 79 Bultaco sherpa-t to the 99 300, the sherpa-t with a few mods to help make the clutch "pull" easier meant a lot of compromises... For one, since the leverage was increased so you could almost pull it with one finger, it would drag. when you went to start it, it would slip, so you would adjust the cable adjuster so it would catch enough to start the bike. I know this throws a lot of guys off, if they come from Honda/Montesa's as the clutch definitely doesnt drag, one buddy already left gasgas for a beta, I dont know if that clutch or how it works either, havent heard him complain, but again all of these I know are the 06-12 Pro Engines. as I have stated, I am NOT positive you will eliminate the drag. but I do recall what I said before about using less oil and as I found that info out many years ago, it was becuase of drag... What you will find though is, you'll use rear the brake all the time to stop the bike from creeping, in the sections anyway, and to me it makes it easier to balance when the bike has ever so slight load on it. shift to neutral as you come to a stop, instead of waiting until you stop, tricks like that work well. Hope this helps, and I wish I had better news/info but that said again, it has been a while. might message JSE at some point, he is/was a very knowledgable GasGas tech, as seen from the gasgas.com website where most of the tech info he helped or wrote. 2 more radical ideas, I guess. IF there is ANY damage to the clutch line? WHY? if the fluid "expands" the line instead of the line being pretty rigid, the ever so small amount of pressure/volume of fluids being pushed to the slave, would be decreased significantly proportional if it expands at all instead of forcing the pressure to goto the slave where motion would be beneficial... 2 and of course you make darn sure you have "some" free play as well as adjust the lever to "at rest" be farther away from the bars, gives you more fluid movement of course, because you add to the stroke. Example: with my kid, when he was under 12 years old, & with small hands, we adjusted the levers at rest, to be closer to the bars, when you let go of the clutch lever, this meant there again would be some compromise, because when he pulled the lever 1 inch less distance the clutch would not disengage as far as it would with levers adjusted like he does now at almost 17 (much bigger hands and longer fingers) with longer throw on the master-cyl. good luck.

Reputation, if used here like we use at other web boards, is a feedback accounting system, for users who sell and buy things to and from other members. this way if dude"x" is setting his leftover brake levers, and has been a good person on the transactions, his ratings go up. I cant assume this is the same here, as I seem to recall 2 people I bought things from on here, had the posts taken down, lol...

Im going to dare jump in, this "continued" (but from where) thread, and ask you: What oil are you using, are you riding trials with it, and how much oil did you put in it? that older engine, hardly ever recall it dragging, and if it is it was soo slight, I got used to it so quickly it didnt bother me anymore. plus all the newer bikes from GG drag ever so slightly, I wonder if it was so the gearbox was loaded instead of fear of "gears slapping" when you dumped the clutch at 12,000 rpms (or whatever the pro level riders do it at, you seen vids, you know they scream them...) For Trials usage ONLY: use automatic transmission fluid, Ive always used Type F, and I think you dont use synthetic on them old bikes, I think the seals in the slave cylinder could be affected, as far as I know. JSE will come along and correct me if I was worng on that one. the thinner AFT type F We used seems to let the plates slip easier, I guess the thickness of molecules? With that: I believe you need to measure 450 cc's of that fluid, which can allieviate 1% (minimal amount is my point) of "dragging" because the oil is somehow pushing the higher levels of oil, like a pump when clutch is fully pulled... if you arent doing trials, I would NOT do the above, because is a lot less oil in trans area than website now says, but I have this neat flyer I printed off gasgas website back in 02, that says 450cc is the setup, in the 99 txt 321 that I had.

Hensley, I was shocked to read about the list of clubs is gone. Anyway never thought Brian would remove it, but I know, and I have felt the same about hard work to keep up, since unlike MOTOCROSS being a money making enterprise, almost all Trials clubs and everything involved is done as VOLUNTEER labor and meager funds (for hosting?). Anyway, did Brian send that list to you? For What It is Worth, When I read this about clublist being gone at NATC, I have the list found on the WAYBACK machine, circa 2008 ish I think, that I was only able to copy and paste from an archived image of the website before wayback quit archiving websites. I will have to contact Brian about maybe I can get his last list, and I can volunteer to make/keep up the list maybe? If not, you and I will start on making the new list, and maybe Brian wouldn't mind, he could link to it. I just do NOT have any webspace to put it onto, yet. I think I have buddies that do have web space though.

I'll bite... what bike? I assume Pro? What do you hope this will accomplish? I believe it is common knowledge that the bigger hoses allow more "expansion" of the lines, before xfer/delivery of fluids to the slave (miniscule, but worth noting I guess?). if the clutch plates, and fingers aren't adjusted to spec, I dont know what you fix or gain, with "bigger" clutch master cylinder & hose, but wouldn't mind hearing what ya'll have in mind?

I'll add a guess on top of ZIPPY'z excelent guess... wheel bearings, maybe a brake pad piston that works "free-er" on one side of the caliper than the other? good luck.

"nationals" have to be not withstanding in this discussion, unlike a club event (mostly) because the draw/intent of a national or regional is the better riders from all the classes, travel more or less to go to compare abilities, hoping to "win". Plus there are the handfulls that have money & will travel just to have fun and be there... When i was not great in whichever class i participated in, throughout the years, I used such events as "learning opportunites" and sure wouldnt complian about difficulty at the time. I punched out on 2 sections at Oklahoma's nationals on 2010, mostly because hopes of the 15+ dabs to save a 3, would make section after it at risk of a 5 due to exhaustion... sometimes a loss of 2 points(scoring total difference of 3 vs 5) can be gained or save a loss of 5 points later, in a section I had a chance to get through. Any club that has killer novice sections has some other problem, most likely "sandbagger central syndrome". if people are in novice long enough that you have to challenge them with high amature sections, is messed up. Novice is about turns, balance, grades, off camber turns (slight), and logs or rocks no bigger than a regular railroad tie, and as previously mentioned rocky creeks or gulleys that are mild of course. However it is NOT totally unusuall to see harder (not more dangerous) sections by September, because maybe there are 2 or 3 guys in that class battling it out. Something else you have to tell the riders at every meet is (we do) YOU DO NOT HAVE TO ATTEMPT SECTIONS THAT LOOK TOO DIFFICULT!... there is no honor lost to punch out on a section, when you start trails. i have actually started a couple guys prematurely one summer, and one had more trouble on the loop than I could have imagined. a couple sections were on the hard side. I had to judge so didnt know he'd had that much trouble just riding from section to section, let alone the section. I finally caught up on the action and the rider and re explained that he should not attempt those sections that looked evil. He said it wasnt evil, but it was harder than he though, and fell down long before the "problem" he thought was at. still it was nothing like falling off a MX bike at 40+ mph not negotiating a whoop or a turn...

Beta Trials, you type more eloquently than I can, you said it. Alan BC, Is your clubs "novice" class that hard? around here only clumsey people get hurt in novice, and there are those types out there. Most though couldnt get hurt without tryin around here. I believe Most clubs setup or used to setup beginner classes for NEW to motorcycles and Trails as well - riders. maybe you club has somehow skipped up a skillset or something??? As novice around here can be riden on a KDX enduro type bike, with a good top of class amature on it, Riding it withoug a dab? maybe not.

the pro's have a black waterpump on the wet side case (clutch). there is a brass cap bearing slash drain plug, uses NOT an allen wrench, but a torx. remove that and the cap on radiator, you will get "most" of it out that way, you can lean over and what have ya to get more out. I will mention might as well just take the hose off the pump, only because as sure as it hasnt happened to me, you could lose that little washer behind that brass cap. that cap is actually a bearing for the Waterpump shaft. see this so you know what all is there. http://www.youtube.com/user/GASGASinfo#p/u/23/AEqQvL23bgs As far as putting back in, fill it up, make POSITIVE that the vent hose is NOT blocked or pinched, ride a little and recheck. I dont know for sure about bleed system, if you are saying like some cars, that trap air in coolant system, I dont think you will have that problem, ride a bit to warm, check level. should be close to the neck, if you over full (in to where cap seals) it will push out the vent, kinda self leveling. Good luck.

I had been working on a reply to your "Golden Rules" and I have a totaly differnt take, to your theory & rules above. Well not "all of them" but how do you define fun? TO me, Fun was borderline Oklahoma Nationals this year, where I rode for the 1st time, in the support 40 class. I am an intermediate rider, should have rode the clubman, but that is another story. I had hopes of comapring my riding with other like skill level and minded people. Still that was FUN, I tested myself and learned I need more skills and practice, and that is what I set out to do all this year, practice and push myself. Now about the "never too easy novice"... When you dumb down a class (make it too easy) it us just like making the pockets bigger on a snooker table, or putting those airbags in the gutter for bowling, sure it makes the kids feel good, like trophys for both teams at the YMCA soccer tournament... instant gratification I guess. I grew up before that I guess, as it DIDN'T make me feel good ever. I felt better when I was finally able to roll the ball "without hitting gutters" like a big person, so I guess to each might be his own, HUH?. Not to say they could make a second place trophy, but the same trophy's lol! Anyway I notice this stuff, and hate that I think it is a trend in the USA to cater too much to instant gratification of people. I hate that is seems like the good idea, but it has terrible lasting effects on any club, as well as the riders that got that treatment. Here is my reasoning, argue if you wish, I am not bashing you, just stating why I dont like that "never can make it too easy for NOVICE". No, not sure what the cure would be, probably a beginner "exit" if needed, so you can make it for those who want a taste, yet you dont want to "kill em" in the novice class. Novice, since inception, is about a skill set you need to be proficient at to be good in that class. Sure another big part of that is having competiton, that is another story yet a valid issue. I can't emphasize enough for a new person, it is something to "work for". When you accomplish that, that is when the rewards feel so damn sweet. Actually every class is is about a skill set and ability, each progression in classes, grow by building on what you had to learned in the class before. being good at to be at EXPERT and masters, meant you know your novice skills better than you know your mom or partner Each class above assumes you can hand the now present obstacles and techniques from the class below, plus now we increase the difficulty a bit, and add techniques you better learn, if you want to win. WHen you remove the difficulty for those "might ride" novice to ride, the ones that "will ride" moves up and cant ride amature, you dumb it back, they moves up... The cycle continues infinitum. So forsaking the guys that make the commitment to show up and ride, you cater to the casual rider that hasn't officially taken the plung, more times than not. You cant cater "Trails" to people who are just wanting a place to have a "pleasant" trail riding day, putting on a trials is a crapload of work. Every club has these kinds of people, ask them "how are you practicing" when they have a hell of a time with the section you are judging, they respond "hell I havent ridden since last trails." Many times you hear comments about the sections too dang hard, from these same and seemingly vocal individuals. and most of these people say that, no matter what time of year. There are more riders that practice for hours each week to get better, for a reason, to get better and get that feeling of accomplishment, that reward for the effort. I feel that you take the accomplishment away when you make sections too easy even novice. Don't do that to those people. all you can do is encourage the heck out of the newby's by telling them, "hey if it was easy, no one would bother or everyone would be doing it" and trying to help them. Kinda like give a man a fish, or teach him to fish... I think people find it fun, or they really wont, but let's keep it fun for those who do, hopefully we'll keep finding others to join us, that will! Anyway, Ill see if this flame suit works...

I believe you need to tell the trucking company that that crate you give them is "bike parts," saves you money? least that is what I read other places, might been on this very board???? somewhere. Bike has to be empty of fuel and oil, antifreeze? but who checks that?

Ya dont own one do ya....? the kicker stops on the footpeg. the shifter works perfectly, plus is adjustable, if you freaking tweak something, unlike some bikes I own, you replace everything until it works properly again. the shifter lever that bolts on, which has the stress releif cut, seems BRILLIANT, plus as there is a purpose built weak part on the end of the shaft inside by the flywheel((((meant Clutch Basket...))), that breaks loose if you get a leverage on the lever too strong for the internals to take. So to me, breaking the lever that can be welded and is (something like 80 dollars us, easily replaced by "owner' with pliers) instead of having to become some a motorcyle mechanic to split cases to fix the internals, well that seems again, a briliant design. Then again you could just add pounds of weight and call it a Sher-beta-tessa... Your mileage WILL vary... EDIT: silly rabbit.

Good to know, JSE sir. learning something new every day.

I like pokey 300 engines, that run like old bultaco's compared to your pipey 250... On mine, I do a thick combination of gaskets below cylinder, no head gasket mods, flywheel weight. Here's a Bolt on: S3 makes insert-adjustable volume cylinder heads now, for I think all 3 sizes of bikes (125/250-280/300). Seems they offer a lower compression insert (larger cylinder volume), with that, you would take away a lot of the 'hit' the bike gives you. You should search web for what Gasgas said as to why they lengthend the headpipe, seems it only changes where the gobs of torque (or the "hit") comes in, that is in relation to the RPMs... And not so much about taking it away. So if lengthening it moves that "hit" part to farther up the RPM range, it could be a good thing for you...? Since you would run at bottom end of rpm ranges to keep the bike under you. Lastly, I just thought of as I type.... you could restrict the exhaust slightly, try a spark arrestor screen and modify it with a washer to reduce the final exit hole diameter, then yo can dril out to 'tune'. I suggest the spark arrestor like we have in the states only for a pattern that could be slip on and remove later without ruining the exhaust. Restricting the exhaust has to work, we did it in the 70's and 80's trying to tame the jap bikes. Plus the Montesa's had I think, 3 different baffles in the 4rt stock, that people remove to "unleash" power, so seems it could be something to try to "lame up" the bike a bit. I definitely would make it an easily reversible modification, lol. I'm sure it would be a small project, trying to find that perfect restriction that allows the bike to run OK yet with less power... But would seem easy enough.

Not saying it is "right" but our club and some others in the plains, break up the riders into morning and afternoon classes. this also affects section building as the morning classes have a nice but similiar range of "techniques" they are tested on, just varying degrees of difficulty... same with upper classes. So out here the two groups are: beginner or juniors/novice/amature/senior amature... Morning Rider classes Then intermediat/sr expert/expert/master.... Afternoon Rider classes. And since we've done it this long, the sections are totally different because it is kind of hard to make master sections that a novice can walk through let alone ride through... So there are 2 sets of 8 up to 12 sections setup each month, for the 2 groups. So when the Morning riders compete, the other class sections are CLOSED. This allows the opposite class of riders, to be picked to judge, and bonus tear down sctions when that group of riders are done. Judgeing is compulsory but also is handled in a lottery fashion, as long as there are more riders in a group than judges needed. Any clubmember knows they are responsible to be there to judge the other class, so if you miss the morning sign up, and "judging selection" (based from rider signup of course) it is very frowned upon. I think our club is a bunch of close friends that like to get together and compete, this might not be the case in your club. I can't probably get you to believe how I feel that we are more than fortunate with our club's attitude, everyone seems to abide and respect the needs to judge if asked, and stuff like that. I think our region, since that is all I have been to, are good about being a judges. I'll admit that when I was younger I didnt like to judge, as I got older I appreciated it more to be a judge. I like seeing the newer riders, encourage them, plus that BONUS that saved me from that dreaded "wrecked and or hurt before my class rides" syndrome I went through as a young rider... Worst problems you can cause: you can have is that your club HAS to emphasize that NO MATTER WHAT THE REASON, IF YOU ARE DONE ATTEMPTING SECTIONS AS SET FOURTH IN RULES (complete all three loops, or if you break down, or just give up) YOU TURN YOUR CARD IN, OR AT LEAST TELL THE CARD GATHERER YOU ARE DONE/UNABLE TO FINISH. You JUST CANT leave the judges out there for no reason, send a rider to tell the judges everyone is done ASAP! Usually we have stragglers, someone follows them around a close sections as they get done. Closing means you rip up ribbons and splits, get ready for your ride (or the awards before you go home).

Most likely! I believe we did it the pretty much the same way on the older gasgas trials bikes, just I suggest doing it with wheels off groud (rear wheel at least). since the pamp should be heavier so "at rest" might compress more for static starting point?

I think I missed that the bike was brand new. Well, I think the consensus is that the GRO oil is good stuff, as I understand they like/recommend breaking in the GAS GAS bike with that oil (heard that from a couple other riders). So it all might change when you change the oil in the future. How long until you were supposed to change the oil? I notice mine acts differently depending on how cruddy the oil is, FWIW. Remember the trans oil lubes crank bearings as well, so maybe some of the gunk is from combustion over time? I try to change oil after 8 hours or so of good practice or events, ATF is cheap. I not positive on what Copey is sayin, but in case I am probably opposite of his suggestion? Anyway, I think you want the clutch engagement as far from the grip as possible, where you are reaching comfortably with the finger as as extended you can get it and pull it without moving the rest of your hand when you do this. BTW when you do this, it helps in 3 ways. 1: reaction time, you have an emergency situation where the bike is going to stall, you go to pull the clutch, sure it is micro seconds, but hey it makes a big difference especially if you don't have the finger on the clutch all the time! 2: you will discover you have more dexterity at the end of your fingers reach (for varying amounts of say 1/2 inch of lever movement) than when your finger is close to a fist for that same amount of lever movement. yeah it takes about 30 minutes to get used to this way, and a day of practice or two to get really comfortable with this. 3: lets you pull the clutch farther when you pull all the way to your fingers to find neutral with less drag because you open the clutches further with the travel of the clutch lever obviously. Again all above is My Humble Opinion, advanced with experience of showing others and it seeming to work as well for them... Your mileage will vary ... Edits, sometimes English is my second language, behind Gibberish.

Just my random thoughts...: you could get the 02 pro clutch cover design from somewhere, maybe S3? AFAIK/understand it had a smaller slave cylinder {top hat and peg inside case). Smaller slave means piston action would be quicker and longer (and harder) by a small bit. seems like this was how Raga liked it at least back in 04-08 {read it somewhere}. yes take the fingers down below 17mm I think you will see quicker clutching. Move the levers to where you grip near the fulcrum (bolt), this would move lever in and out quicker per finger action. I see the big dogs ride this way. Just putting this out there: I am the opposite of you, since I hardly ever really ride with the clutch all the way out, slipping it most of the time (again I'm not a big splatter person) I have my clutch closer to 19 mm spec, or so at the fingers, and I love that I have an area which I have varying amounts of slip and it makes a big difference on how hard it is to pull the clutch. PLUS, I use a transmission fluid that aids in this slipping range. So my clutch is never an ON OFF switch, it is more like a dimmer switch, if you see what I mean. What I see a lot of times for people in (below splatter classes in the USA like Expert) is, that the clutch jerks the bike forward because there is no "feel", it is off/on so a tight turn the bike jumps 4 inches straight ahead instead of turning, which my gasser will NOT do (unless I physically mess up) because I slip the clutch to where it moves the bike without a lurch. Again you probably hop, and do big splatters, so your needs are different than mine. I know the a couple of buddies bikes I test rode, made me nervous because I could't slip it the way I am used to.