woody

On a general basis, I still think that a 30 minute time limit for a protest is totally unworkable. Surely, results posted immediately after an event are provisional, not final, as mentioned elsewhere. There are also the logistics. As I mentioned before, a rider who may have a need to protest may not even see those results within 30 minutes. They also have to find the means of putting it in writing and finding the fee there and then. A rider could finish a trial and be on his way home 2 hours before the last rider has finished. It doesn't seem right to me. Also on a general basis, rider's personalities are definitely relevant as they can and do influence decisions. Not necessarily decisions to actual protests, but to events that could lead to a protest if everyone had a similar win at all costs attitude as some. Personalities can influence observing decisions to their benefit, they can get away with bloody murder, things that others wouldn't (or try to) but most riders know it would be pointless protesting so don't. I've witnessed it many times, it does happen. Back to the actual topic, it's good that the club have made the facts known. It seems a perfectly acceptable situation to me and if the rider is who I think, then I agree with Chris, he is not the type to unfairly seek any advantage.

Alternatively, why do we need to be in a club to have ACU Membership? What is the specific reason for having to be in a club? It's a genuine question as I have no idea what the club membership fee is allocated to. 100% to club coffers or a portion to the ACU?. If I take my own club as an example. It's not a big club. For the last few years there have been 5 active members which includes the non-riding secretary and 2, maybe 3 of us being certified clerks of the course. It's usually been the same 3 people who lay out the trials, 7 or 8 a year roughly (this year we have another 2 or 3 helpers) Historically, any other riders who join the club do so purely to get a licence form signed in order to apply for the ACU registration, usually at our boxing day trial (I'm not criticising this by the way) They aren't actively involved in the club after that, they may ride some of the events. It's impossible to put conditions on membership to say you have to help out by doing x, y or z, as they'd just join another club to get the form signed. So the club membership doesn't really mean anything. The revenue to our club specifically from club membership is insignificant as we probably get 15 - 20 at the most at a guess. So, what purpose does it serve? They aren't active members and the financial gain is too small to be of significance. I can appreciate that to survive, a club needs a membership and if you take away the need to join a club, people may not do so and then what happens to the club. On the flip side, if club members aren't active, the club can still flounder. My argument is that people who are committed to being part of a club and enjoy getting involved in the organisation, will join/renew membership anyway and the club will continue. So, I can see an argument for being able to apply for ACU registration without the application being signed off by a club secretaty confirming club membership. If a rider has ACU registration and enters a trial, aren't they then covered should they suffer some sort of accident and claim? What, if anything would being member of a club add to that? You won't necessarily be a member of the club in whose trial you are riding. So, for trials at least (as a pilot) is it possible to just apply for ACU registration without the need to have a club membership. If this isn't viable, then I favour the earlier proposal that registration includes a nominated club, the fee includes a generic figure for membership (

30 minutes seems an ill thought out time limit. I'm not citing this case specifically but just for argument's sake, it's possible to know a rider is going to be over time and liable to exclusion before seeing any results. You then leave the trial and the results are subsequently published on the scoreboard at the trial. You only see them when you next check a website or receive them in the post, so how can you protest within 30 mins? Finding pen and paper to submit a written application in the middle of a field would be an intereting excercise as well. Getting back to this particular case, if someone knows the reason for time being scrubbed at this trial then why not just put it on here (was it the time limit that was scrubbed or just one individual's time penalty) It's just a trial, it's not the official secrets act and I can't see why it is a problem to say so and so was late and had their time scrubbed because of whatever, or, the time limit was scrubbed for this or that reason. I can understand the original poster not wanting to complain directly about someone, but I can't see anything wrong with someone just stating what happened. Without the facts this discussion is pretty meaningless unless it is just about protest procedures in general.

Look like BHC, British Hub Company

That isn't a low British Pre75 entry for the Normandale series (it's not Pre65 in this series), it's about normal for most rounds. It's the premier national championship for classic riders and the sections offer a challenge in keeping with that, so they are harder than the average club twinshock/pre65 trial, hence the lower number of entries. However, there is nothing silly and they are in truth nowhere near as hard as nationals that we rode in the actual twinshock era. The person you are referring to has contested all Normandale rounds on a modern bike this year and I believe has opted to no longer ride Pre65 regularly. I also heard his Pre65 bike is for sale. Getting back to the original topic though, having time penalties scrubbed is nothing new and I've ridden plenty of nationals over the years when this has happened (as well as many more where it most definitely has not) It's particularly frustrating when riders who hang about to gain an advantage in sections that benefit later numbers then come in late and somehow manage to get the time limit removed. Riders who have not hung around can rightly feel aggrieved at having lost marks in sections that they have not waited to become 'scrubbed in'. They have no recourse or means of having marks removed that they probably wouldn't have lost had they waited another 30 minutes - and then been over the time limit. I didn't ride this event so have no idea of the reasons for scrubbing the time limit, but I can certainly understand the frustration. Punch cards can certainly be a contributory factor in causing delays. Ideally, two observers are needed, one to observe, one to punch. Obviously this is difficult to resource, but with only one it can take a long time to get a card punched in comparison to writing the score on a board.

Does anyone know anything about this event? They used to be two seperate events but looks like they've been combined. It's on the ACU fixture list for 10/7 to be organised by East Midlands centre?? I've heard nothing about it, just wondered if anyone else has.

The Midland Centre doesn't actually have any twinshock clubs, so there are no trials just for twinshocks in this centre. The only classic club is the BMCA which is British bikes only. As mentioned above, the neighbouring East Midland Centre has the Dales Classic and Peak Classic clubs (google for their websites and event calenders) and they run events once a month between them, over in the Derbyshire area. When you look in TMX, there are a couple of classic clubs around Gloucester and Wiltshire to look out for - Golden Valley Classic, Bath Classic. Both run events which would have an easy route suitable for you and most venues are within an hour or so from here. There is Wilts and Dorset club down that way too but they used to be a bit clicky and I never got a ride in one of their events, not sure what they are like now. Over into Mid Wales and there are Border Classic and Aqueduct Classic clubs, both who have an easy route suitable for beginners and again, most events with an hour and a half from here. Most if not all of these clubs have websites so google for them and have a look. However, you aren't confined to just classic trials. Most midland centre clubs now put on trials with 3 routes and the easiest route is aimed at beginners and novices and you will be fine on those sections (it's usually called the white route in this centre) You probably won't be the only twinshock or British bike there either. Also mentioned above is the Bewdley trial on 9th June and this would offer a good introduction to trials as it is for beginners and novices with people on hand to help. You don't say if you are looking to do your first ever trial or just your first twinshock trial, I'm assuming first ever, in which case you will be able to join the Bewdley club and apply for the ACU registration which you will need to compete in ACU events. My club, Stafford Auto, is running a trial on 25th June which is a Saturday afternoon/barbecue trial. It will have a route suitable for you. This is a link to the Midland Centre website, if you click on the events tab it will display the calender of events for this year. The club events that will usually have the white route are denoted MC 'B' http://www.midlandcentreacu.org.uk/index.html

Only my opinion obviously but I think the Yam framed bike is nicer to ride than the Godden framed version. The Godden frame is actually heavier and whilst that itself isn't a problem it's the weight bias I didn't like. The Godden frame is very heavy on the front. The Yam frame is much lighter and makes it easier to lift and flick the front wheel around. I had one of each and preferred the Yam frame. The issue of copies is a subjective one. The original Majesty is only a modified Yam TY250, obviously I'm not overlooking the development skill and knowhow involved in deciding what those modifications were. So if someone else at a later date has modified a standard TY250 into a Majesty copy and got all the dimensions correct, it wouldn't bother me that the bike wasn't originally done at Shirt's place. Obviously I'm not talking about amateur-hour lash-ups here, if a privately modified bike has the same spec and appearance of a Shirt modified bike it should perform the same and in the end they are for riding in competition. Therefore they should fetch the same as a Shirt bike to reflect their competitiveness as a trials bike over a standard TY? - look what modified (or even standard) TLR Hondas fetch and they have no provenance whatsoever. With the Majesty, it was only a few supported riders whose bikes had additional mods to steering, forks, porting etc. Same could be said of a 'new' Majesty. No provenance, it isn't a real Majesty so why would they fetch more than an original Godden on which they are based? This isn't my opinion, I'm just playing devil's advocate on the subject of what something is worth. In the end something is only worth what someone else is willing to pay for it.

I haven't a definitive answer but have you tried Viliers Services as he has a lot of parts, or maybe Nametab. Also, Vale-Onslow in Birmingham if neither of the above. Phone after 11.30am if you try them as Len doesn't get in until then and he is the one that will know I would guess.

Riding position/comfort is subjective and depends how tall you are (or how old... knackered wrists, back etc) The riding position is normal for bikes of that era, the footrests were quite high, especially in comparison to today's bikes. So even with 6" rise bars, a rider over 6' is going to feel hunched however you position them. You may be able to find some 6.5" rise bars but they are not common anymore, 6" is usually the maximum. If it is really causing you a problem you will need to fit some kind of bar riser or relocate the footrests to a lower position

It's definitely not a novice bike that's for sure, the power is incredible. However, with the timing retarded against the stops and a flywheel weight it can be trickled around on the throttle like a TY175. Open the throttle though and it's off. It will stand on the back wheel in 4th from tickover and makes even my ported 340 Sherpa feel like a 250 in terms of bottom end torque. It's similar to the Sherpa in that the exhaust needs to be kept well packed otherwise the performance will go off. Other than that it is fine and totally unfussy. Just the typical Rotax clutch that lets it down. I'd go as far as saying the chassis is a touch better than a Fantic, it steers/turns quicker, front end is much lighter and rear suspension action is just as good. Fine in nadgery stuff. Front forks a bit iffy but that can be sorted. It is more nervous and twitchy than a Fantic chassis though.

You don't mean the very last 349 do you, as in the 349/4, MH349 and Cota 350 models, all essentially the same bike. They were good, better than the later 330 in my opinion, only let down by the clutch. Not as good as a Fantic I'll agree, but not that far away.

I suppose you can't blame him for trying. You never know, someone may be willing to pay it.

The C15 is a better engine for trials as it needs less work to put into trials trim. A standard road engine is fine as it is and just needs the gearing lowered. B25 has a big valve head, bigger inlet tract and much lighter crank assembly. They were designed as a 'revver' rather than a 'plonker' type motor and have better top end power whereas the C15 produces better torque low down. The light weight of the B25 crank makes them easy to stall so you need to use the clutch more. The C15 has a really heavy crank assembly and will chug to a virtual standstill, clutch out. The B25 is more prone to spit stalling due to the more racy head design. This isn't to say they won't make a decent trials motor as they will, but more work is needed over a C15. The frame on the ebay bike could well be a genuine Pre65 as that design with the 'V' shaped subframe was available in 1964, so the Pre65 label in the title isn't really inaccurate. The engine isn't Pre65 but what is anymore, Pre65 is just a generic label now that has stuck - Pre70 is more accurate these days as most trials run Pre70 British as a class, not Pre65, apart from the 3 mentioned above.

Most are Pre70 classes so it wouldn't matter It's only Scotland it couldn't be ridden, Yorkshire and Red Rose classic would probably insist it go in the specials class

Take your piick from Fantic 200/240/300, 310/320 Armstrong, 320 Aprilia, 320 Garelli, 320 SWM, Cagiva 350 Daddy of the lot though would be a well set up 350 SWM Jumbo. Modern geometry, light front end that can be easily placed and one of the tourquiest trials motors you could wish for. Most powerful of the lot.

They are just a bit long that's all, not as nimble as other bikes. Fine though for most of today's classic trials which are nowhere near as hard as centre/national trials of the day. Don't forget that the bikes ridden by the factory riders could be nothing like the production versions.

Found the shock - OD of the spring is 80mm, the spring coil/wire thickness is 10mm so ID is 60mm.

Just found my manual whilst looking for an Ossa one... Spring free length is 160mm Spring rate is 7kg/mm or 392lbs/in It doesn't give the spring ID or OD but somewhere I may have an old knackered shock so I'll measure it if I can find it. Not sure which year bike this manual is for now but I'm guessing the shocks were probably the same spec. It is for serial number 4GG-28199-80 according to the front cover.

Unless you've bought a different kind of badge, they should be self-adhesive, just peel off the backing and stick on, same as Bultaco badges. These stick fine to new paint, nothing else is needed.

One finished, two didn't. Not a dickybird on what happened. Really surprised that after the panning the Greeves has taken on this forum over the last couple of years, people haven't been flooding in with the 'I told you so' quips. Equally surprising that as it was the debut of an all British bike, there was no feedback, updates or apparent interest during the event itself, despite a thread being started. I'd have thought it was an ideal topic for the daily blog.

Oh well, it's peeing down outside, I've finished my tax return so what to do next. I know, prattle on about 70s bikes in answer to your question. A late 250 Bultaco, say model 190 onwards, is a good bet. Cheaper to buy than the 325 as everyone seems to want the bigger version, but the 250 is a perfectly capable bike. Very good spares availablilty, new or used and one of the easiest bikes to work on, both chassis and engine. Just watch out for the condition of the hubs as if the chrome has peeled badly it's about

I doubt it would matter if he was on a stock bike anyway in the SSDT as a stock bike can cope perfectly well with the sections. Big power and super light weight isn't really necessary. I had hoped he would win, not because he was on the Mont particularly, just because I think he is an excellent all-rounder and seems to genuinely enjoy his riding, trials or enduro. Difficult to see Honda going 2-stroke as it is against everything they have preached in recent years. Who knows whether there will be a new trials bike even. History shows they feel no need to produce a copy or replica of the world round bikes as there was never a production version of the works 305 or 360 twinshock. They were winning titles and that was enough. The RTL Mono works bikes were drastically different from the production bikes (especially Lejeunes aborted 360) and when titles eluded them they pulled the plug. Seems it's all about winning titles, as mentioned in other posts. As long as Bou is winning the title for them, I'd agree with previous posts, they probably won't care if there is a production bike or not as it is such small beer in terms of revenue.

The engine internals on the RTL and TLR are basically the same, piston, valves, cam etc. The RTL has a different ignition which gives a different power characteristic, smoother off idle than the TLR which in standard config is too sharp, prone to spit stall and doesn't rev out. Valve timing may differ as well. Later RTL had a bigger clutch and different gear ratios. Jerry - not sure which TLR you are referring to, the twinshock TLR wasn't made in '87, they were '84. The TLR250R was '87 but that was a different bike althogether, monoshock and a different engine.

Brilliantly done and very funny. I'm crying with laughter. "we'll get him a Beta"