atomant

You make a valid point but I cant see that they would design a unit that would fail to critical. In other words, if it fails, it will fail to a safe position and shut off. Simply because if it did and an accident occured, they would be sued to the beams. It simply would not comply to CE certification. Also, as I just flown 4000+ miles in an Emirates 777-300ER which is digital fly-by-wire, it better not break down on the trip back

Well done Ross That 125 gasser is the dogs danglies oh, I forgot, and you can ride a bit too which helps

Disc brakes acknowledged Don I reckon the next BIG step in trials is taking it Electric. A fully electric bike would suppress the Environmental Lobby, You can ride it without making any noise. That would open up lots of new areas and places to ride. The bike would be a cross over from MTB and trials technology. (as suggested above). Sinclair's battery technology could be adapted. The bike could reach 50kg! What do you reckon to that?

LMAO

Good question! No, not really, but as you said, trials bike lag behind the rest of the industry probably down to money and the fact that the manufacturers would be unlikely to be too bold on something new as the damage it can do to sales and the brand is difficult to repair- Look what happens when they get it wrong (Sherco 4T 320 as an example) The Monoshock has got to be the best development ever for a trials bike? I cant think where the next ground breaking innovation is going to come from in trials. Throttle by wire would be an incremental step of course.

I was talking in the Sherco 4T forum and this topic come up. I thought it might make a good discussion topic so I dropped it in here. We started talking about throttle by wire as a possibility for a trials bike.. heres the comments .. Wow, Throttle by wire? What would the carb over EFI brigade make of that then? It's be the same response as people who first disparaged linkage suspension, electronic ignition, water cooling, disc brakes, perimeter frames...at first they'll complain, then they'll embrace it as a must-have feature. The advantage to throttle-by-wire is not the elimination of the cable, as I'm sure you know. It's about the ability to personalize throttle response. You can make it as fast or slow as you prefer, as straight or progressive as you like. It is another great step forward in allowing us to make the bike work exactly as we want, so we can ride as well as possible. How many people map their own 4RT's? I get the distinct feeling that trials is still way way behind the technological development curve. The fact is the technology is there, and been there for ages. If the trials market wanted it, we would have had it long ago. The reality is that peeps are still happy to buy a brand new bike knowing they have to drill holes in the carb, and all the other things they do We don't seem to be a very demanding bunch of customers? Would I be correct in saying that all design enhancements we have seen on bikes since the 80's have come from manufacturers pushing new technology as opposed to trials riders demanding it?

Wow, Throttle by wire? What would the carb over EFI brigade make of that then? It's be the same response as people who first disparaged linkage suspension, electronic ignition, water cooling, disc brakes, perimeter frames...at first they'll complain, then they'll embrace it as a must-have feature. The advantage to throttle-by-wire is not the elimination of the cable, as I'm sure you know. It's about the ability to personalize throttle response. You can make it as fast or slow as you prefer, as straight or progressive as you like. It is another great step forward in allowing us to make the bike work exactly as we want, so we can ride as well as possible. How many people map their own 4RT's? I get the distinct feeling that trials is still way way behind the technological development curve. The fact is the technology is there, and been there for ages. If the trials market wanted it, we would have had it long ago. The reality is that peeps are still happy to buy a brand new bike knowing they have to drill holes in the carb, and all the other things they do We don't seem to be a very demanding bunch of customers? Would I be correct in saying that all design enhancements we have seen on bikes since the 80's have come from manufacturers pushing new technology as opposed to trials riders demanding it?

Wow, Throttle by wire? What would the carb over EFI brigade make of that then?

You aren't talking about this fella are yer? **** me that photo has had some use. If I could remember who snapped that I'd break his index finger That of course was before I became beautiful (and put on even more weight). I thought he was talking about me for a while too. I've not dropped to novice route yet though, but it does seem to be coming up to meet me. The over 40's are calling It definitely can help Spud as long as your arms and lungs are capable of keeping the weight in the right area. You'll notice that in the photo above my arms and lungs have managed to concentrate the weight in the area above my belt, and some around the jowels. I remember one Novogar trial (I think maybe the Victory) where all of our riders had failed a muddy bank (last section in a sticky wood that you go over a foot bridge as you go in, if anyone remembers it). Nobody could get any grip at the bottom of the bank. I was fancying 3rd gear, but all our lads were coaxing me to rev its nuts off in 4th and let the clutch out. I hate wringing it's neck, but as a special request I thought what the hell and gave it a go, full throttle, fed the clutch out, the bike gripped like a JCB and ground to a halt. 19 stone holds it down On the plus side the tyre I took off just before the Manx had a dog turd in it that I put in last year on the Manx. If it don't spin it don't wear out On the negative side I'll probably die before the skinny bloke despite having enjoyed getting there . Unless that skinny bloke was the one that took the photo above Pleased to see you took it in good spirit p.s. Glad I never took it On a serious note, Ross has always looked impressive in the mud, and he can't be more that 10st surely

You aren't talking about this fella are yer?

Honda is selling its in-house EFI to Gas Gas? I doubt that, but I suppose anything is possible. Could Gas Gas be taking Xispa's lead and ripping the design Bike looks good btw Look even better with EFI !! Then I would have one in the garage too

I rode sirhc's bike (he's a Sherco/Scorpa dealer, BTW) after Sunday's trial. I had ridden the '05 320 and was not happy at all. It was clearly not ready for prime time. If it had been the first 4T, it would have killed the concept dead. However, on my short ride, I can tell you that the '07 320 is a vastly superior machine. Not only does it kick over more easily, it also fires more readily. That, in and of itself, is a huge improvement. The power delivery still feels lumpy compared to my Cota 4RT, but if you want brute force, the 320 has it. Also, I loved how light it is. The front end is really easy to pick up and move around. The "extreme conditions" that sirhc is referring to when riding the 320 is "riding it like a Cota 4RT". I snuck up to a rock, clutch out, just like I do on my 4RT. Wicked it on, expecting that nice burst. Instead, it died in that 4T-with-carb way, and I was pitched over the bars. Uh, yeah. Thanks, here's your bike back. I saw another guy get on the bike, a much better rider than me. He rides a Cota 315R. He had the same experience I did. He gave it gas at a near standstill, and to a standstill it came. Ultimately, there is no substitute for EFI on a 4T. Sure, you can ride around the problems inherent with a carb, but that's no substitute for doing it right. Strange you should have the exact reverse of the experience I had but hey, thats personal opinions for ya I have to agree over the EFI. I simply wouldn't touch another 4T unless it had a quality EFI system fitted

Yes Yes 250,280 or 300 - yet to decide

"Maybe it hits home how small the sport is in the UK" A good motorcycle shop in the UK, probably sells more new bikes, [ insert brand ] than the importer for that brand in the US and many other countries around the world. The ability of the top riders isn't in question, it's the ability to make a living or at least pay the expenses, if this can't be done, should it not be a true amateur sport, all on stock bikes and prize money instead of sponsorship and factory contracts ?. Say the total factory expenses for all the factories to run a team for the year was two million Euro, divided by ten rounds, paying 1st through 15th. Do you think you would see more riders participating if there was a chance of an earner. We now have the youth 125, Junior, and world champ, will this sort out most before they get to world champ, I don't mean on ability, I mean financially. I've been thinking for a while for some viable alternatives to what we have now for the top boys and this sounds as good as any. Being devils advocate, wouldn't the manufacturers want to sponsor the riders though? How else would they get their brand in the public spotlight to try and sell some? As an example, If Honda weren't paying for the top riders, I would suggest Dougie and Bou wouldn't be on 4rt's by choice as then it was still perceived 2T's were superior.

Nope, like there isn't another 50 potential F1 drivers who could jump in a car and beat Alonso. Time to get off the F1 theme me thinks

Not really, costs would come down hugely. High paid drivers and big motorhomes would go but it would carry on. Dont forget F1 has Honda, Renault, BMW, Mercedes, Toyota and Fiat (Ferrari), they are a few companies that arent exactly short of money. Im sure if they wanted either of them could buy Gas Gas, Sherco & Beta without worrying about what it would cost. It wasnt that long ago (early 80's) you could run a F1 team on 5million a year, it would just go back to that. Not forgetting that those car manufacturers you mentioned are sponsors themselves in their own right. F1 wont go far with no engines What would happen to trials if Honda pulled out? WTC is basically a Honda showcase these days.

Very poor analogy. F1 has speed, excitement (well, compared to trials and again, from a purely casual observer's perspective) and it's easy to provide TV coverage due to the short lap, easy access and on-site facilities. People can relate to F1 because, well, they're just cars right? And that means heavy involvement and investment from major manufacturers which means $$$$. Trials has none of those attributes, all of which are essential for a sport to become commercially successful. F1 would continue to exist if there were just 10 cars on the grid, I've absolutely no doubt of that. In fact, it would probably just add to the mystique due to the perceived exclusivity. I agree and also to add to this, The barriers to entry are huge in F1. The cost's of a team for a start and then when you have a driver, a car, and a team, you still have to be competitive else you dont get a place on the starting grid. But, the parallels you can draw with F1 are that the same faces appear on the podium all the time. Watching Shumacher turn up and win all the time got so boring I stopped watching it. (Will Toni Bou do the same in trials?) But can you name the team that comes last every time for instance? Maybe you can or maybe you cant but the driver of that car that comes last still gets a pay cheque and a healthy one at that! Which is way more than what the WTC champion is getting never mind anyone else.

So at the first ride you would say you are happy with it? Whats it like at slow tight turns?.

Thinking about this a little, I think we are discussing the WTC as it stands being the pinnacle of the sport and hence at the top of the pyramid. The problem of course is the foundations the pyramid is built on. I think there is something that we can all agree on and that is there is a significant disconnect between WTC (as it is today) and the grass route trials. You go and see a circus and look and marvel at the highwire act and think thats amazing - you dont for one second think Right ,I'm off to learn that - that is something I could do! .... Its like that with the WTC. The guys are sooooo skilled that they have taken it beyond mere mortals and therefore the term circus is used because the similarities are there. Because of this, as its the showpiece, new blood will not be tempted to by it, unless they are already top trials cycle riders for instance. The other thing as well, is when you have seen one highwire act, you have seen them all.... and it tires after a while. The WTC pulls a loyal hardcore bunch of punters but thats it. How can it grow if it isn't attracting the right kind of people outside the hardcore. One other thing talking about Dabster's opinion on the WTC - Yes yes yes thats all well and good - BUT WHO IS PAYING THE BILLS FOR ALL RIDERS OUTSIDE THE TOP 5!! Interesting you should suggest the Xtreme channel as that supports what I am saying above! WTC has become a new discipline of motor sport. Its not trials as most people know it. Remember that pyramid. Dodgy foundations and its all going to come crashing down! Compare this to Golf, and I know (like most golfers) every now and then I hit a golf shot as good as Tiger Woods can hit it. To know that for a brief moment you can emulate a great is a real buzz. There is NO CHANCE that 99.99% of all trials riders could ever emulate Toni Bou.

Over layed the sound of a 4 stroke - Corny add but nice to see them use trial bike - shame its advertising the weed

Thanks for that TFT. It would be interesting to do a poll and see how many people would like to see the WTC change from what it is now, into something else.( but what would that be?) Or whether they just like it at it is?

That was the original idea of the ISDT (now ISDE) but it evolved into a time trial as opposed to an observation trial. Why didn't it work as an observation trial then ?

Errr , who won it last year ? Clue Here

Can't have the tightest man in Trials donating and me not! Sorted! Bloody ell! You guys beat France by 1 goal and its gone to ya heads!!! We won't mention your rugby scores then Ian.........

Can't have the tightest man in Trials donating and me not! Sorted! Bloody ell! You guys beat France by 1 goal and its gone to ya heads!!!