atomant

John , thank you for taking the time to post some constructive and helpful comments. This problem, as you have said, has been around for a long time and didn’t just rear its head in this particular trial and the very fact that you will look at this is certainly a good thing in my eyes As for the trial itself, I for one thought the trial was a big success and wouldn’t hesitate to go and watch another one of this type. It's certainly exciting from the spectator’s perspective. The 1 1/2 minute time allowance heightens the level of excitement which keeps you on the edge. Loved it To all the people involved in making this happen Also, big thanks to all the people who participated in this meaningful and well balanced discussion

Look guys, don’t take this thread down the route of which rules to ride.. The reason I started this thread is to find a way of addressing the issue of riders rushing to finish a trial due to time penalties increasing the risk of injury to themselves and to spectators/observers. In reality, they bring it on themselves by taking so long to do the first lap (as said above). 5 1/2 hours IS plenty of time, its just the way its managed that needs improving... So a time limit on the first lap is a good solution or get the observers to give the rider a 10 for a non attempt when asked? Or are there better ideas?

Well its certainly a workable solution. I say give it a go

I agree Heath, as I said above, I thought it was great to watch and the way forward however, not to get off topic, its only going to be a matter of time before someone gets seriously hurt unless this 'time' issue is dealt with!

I assume the observers can use the rule to ask the riders to attempt the section if they are waiting around too long. Failure to do so . 10 points is it not??Watch em get on their bikes and form an orderly cue

Firstly, my comments were a general observation and not directed at Neath MCC who done a sterling job under the conditions! Secondly, The FIM rules adopted with the time penalty 'IN' the section is the way to go. Much better from a spectators viewpoint. The only thing I feel that needs looking at is something to stop everyone rushing around like crazy with the number 1 priority of getting finished without penalties at all costs. The whole feeling I got from the day was a hectic race. I agree there must be a time limit and I haven’t advocated getting rid of it, what I am saying is change the way it works to make it more effective.

At the St Davids trial on Sunday when Jake fell off and was hurt bad, (think he went to hospital and hope he’s alright ) whilst the observer went to attend to him, the next rider was pushing him to observe his ride regardless of Jake needing urgent attention. The lad was screaming in agony for Christ sake! I felt sickened by the whole affair.. When someone gets hurt, they must become the chief priority and everything else has to come second. This is all because they have to rush round to get finished to avoid time penalties.. Trials of this type must change from being a race to a thing of skill. Have less sections or give more time to complete or something else but change it to get the priorities in the right order. Inadvertently adding an element of speed adds unnecessary risk of injury for riders (and spectators moving between sections), especially when at its heart, its not a speed sport. It must be said that the organising club had safety high on their priority list with standard & air ambulance cover. Hats off to them

Thanks for the pics Heath they look good mate

Wet and muddy but managed to get round to watch it all . Excellent job from the organising club I thought Only downside is I saw Jake Britton take a nasty knock to his knee. I hope hes alright, looked bad and Sam Haslam took a knock also so hope hes alright too. Looked a very tough trial.

Yup, gonna go down and watch it as well. Think its gonna be a good un

GasGas have made an effort by Introducing the Raga and Racing models, which for not alot more money have quite a few "performance enhancing" extras. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Even the Raga is having parts changed already and its only just come out. You will find the shock being changed to the fully adjustable Ohlin. The magnesium swinging arm being changed ( concerns over strength ), The Carb being replaced by a Keihin and the list goes on..I'm sure the manufacturers would get some decent bulk prices for these key components, to offer them as an 'extra' means they could make a bit of money and give a little back to the customer. win win situation.

Ok, well heres a suggestion, why dont the manufactures offer a basic machine then a list of 'extras' similar to buying a new car. Then you can select the performance enhancing parts and have the bike supplied like it. I would agree though that if you are going to spend some money on improving your machine, the suspension would be the first place to look.

Yes but does the 'performancing enhancing extra' make your scores any better? and another point, would you buy a new car then change all the keys parts coz the quality isnt good enough? I thought monts were top dollar for quality should be for the price!

I apologise if you feel my comments are hostile because they simply are not intended as such and after re-reading the posts above I clearly make the case for allowing more scope for riders of all youth ages to develop. When the likes of Ross and the others move on, there will be another set of youngsters coming through who I will only be too pleased to help out and support just like we are doing in our club now and what we intend to do in the future. I spend a lot of my spare time doing support work for youth trials of all ages and abilities even though my own lads dont ride themselves. I'm on your side

I bought an Onzo a few months ago and have been on it a little a bit and im just over 40. I thoroughly recommend it. It helps with the balance a lot and of course fitness. I hope to do a lot more on it now the lighter nights are coming in also, I fall off it a lot less than I do the Sherco

There seems to be a view in some places that if certain riders get 'too' good then thats a bad thing. You call them 'elite' like its a bad thing.. theres no elite about it, they are the best riders in the country whatever class and I for one want them as they are British to be the best riders in the world so lets help them get there not just do half the job In relation to riding the Adult...probably best they dont.. wont do their ego's much good getting beat by a load of kids (very tounge in cheek)

You raise some good points and to answer that, I believe the classes should take into account the skill level and not just age. The Top A class riders are capable of riding even higher level stuff than we put on for them. ( all the sections were cleaned at least once by them at otter vale) so they could ride in a super A level or something like that allowing the slightly less capable riders to achieve something in a toned down A route. How it could be done is with some deviations off the standard A route for the big boys. We done this at nantmawr recently and it seemed to work well. Yes its a bit more work setting out but it was worth it. That way, there is something for everyone.The stepping stones would be less severe and more managable instead of the huge difference from a B to an A route for example The way I see it is the kids need to be sensibly tested and enjoy it and be allowed to grow in skill and confidence. I just cant imagine what a kid whos scoring in the hundreds must be thinking on the way home. Now that surely cant be good for them or the sport ? IMHO

At a club trial I would agree, but not at the top level. Why dont they do it at WTC level then? Simply because there are only 10% or less of the riders in any class capable of winning. All the other competitors are just making up the numbers and to be quite honest, some of them risk serious injury trying to tackle sections at the top level when they simply are way too hard for their capabilities. Just look at the winners score and the last score in any class at any trial to see what I mean.I am a huge supporter of youth trials but I dont enjoy seeing kids fail at section after section. Whats the point of that especially if they get hurt

How many riders at Otter Vale were contesting the whole series? Surely there needs to be some way, like pre-registering for instance, that riders can only enter if they are going to contest the whole series.

... what about the people who don't want to own one? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Its a real shame Sherco messed up with the 4T coz I liked it much more than the 4RT and I am convinced it would have been the most dominant 4T on the market by now if it was right when they released it.

The rules are quite strict when it comes to bike engine sizes. Just get out and start riding as you havent ridden a trial yet have you ?

2000 thats much less than I expected.